Is it time to double the checkoff?

[Anonymous]

Rancher,

Would you like to explain the difference between, "where do most of our imports come from" and "where do the bulk of our imports come from"?

Knock yourself out!



~SH~

 

[RobertMac]

What is the net market share change since the beginning of the check-off?

 

[rancher]

Rancher,

Would you like to explain the difference between, "where do most of our imports come from" and "where do the bulk of our imports come from"?

Knock yourself out!



~SH~

Why would I, you just spin it to fit your mouth and then spew it out with a few names and claim victory. SMILE

 

[rancher]

The bulk could be Canada and Australia or Canada and New Zealand or New Zealand and Australia and the answer would be right. No where did he ask for the bulk of lean imports.

 

[rkaiser]

SH the super hero says -You want the packer to pay the beef checkoff, fine, they will in turn pay that much less for cattle. Whatever! If that will make you feel better, go for it.

You want to think that you have all the truth and all the facts. What a bloody joke of a man.

Your statement says it all. If the packers pay more, the producer will get less.

Never seen such a pathetic childish excuse of a man. No one can disagree with SH the packer super hero or they are an ignorant idiotic liar.

Your take on the checkoff is your take SH. Call it truth and reality all you like. It's yours and your pack of red liberal mutinational bleeding hearts truth and that's that. Stick your truth where the sun don't shine super hero. I'm surviving just fine in my ignorant uninformed world..

 

[Tommy]

Scott where do you come up with these numbers?

SH...Considering that 33% of our population is hispanic do you actually believe they would shy from Mexican beef while they fly their Mexican flags in the U.S.??

Census figures...The Hispanic population numbered roughly 35.3 million in 2000, or about 12.6% of the country's 281 million people the Census Bureau said.


SH...Leave beef marketing up to those that actually understand it. You obviously don't understand that either.



Maybe you should leave figures up to someone else, because 12.6% is WAY different than 33%.

 

[Tam]

I truely feel sorry for you SH. You are such a loser that all you can do is call names to try to make yourself out to be some kind of authority. Pathetic.

Quote:
Randy: "Good one SH, you have just admited that the checkoff does nothing for the producer."


I never said anything of the damn sort! Any increase in consumer demand for beef is reflected in the prices paid for fat cattle. You are simply too ignorant to understand that.


Quote:
Randy: "If the packer pays, he will adjust the price accordingly. And that is the truth."


That's just what I said. If the packer pays the checkoff, it would add to their expenses so they will pay that much less for the cattle. If all the packers give their employees a pay raise, did you think the packers would lose money to pay for it or do you think it would be reflected in the price of fat cattle?

With the lack of understanding of this industry that you have, it's no wonder why you wanted all Canadian producers to contribute to the Big "C".


Quote:
Randy: "I don't believe that Econo was talking about packers paying the beef checkoff so much as paying for their own damn advertising."


Kindergarten doesn't even know what he's talking about so how could you possibly know?


Quote:
Randy: "I won't be convinced by anyone that the checkoff here in Canada or the USA for that matter has increased demand for beef."


Of course you won't because you are a blamer. Facts don't mean anything to you. I could take you into a retail outlet and show you the price of a flat iron steak that used to be ground up. I could show you the checkoff funded research of muscle meat seperation that led to it's discovery and you still wouldn't believe it because you are a chronic bitcher. Truth and facts mean nothing to you.


Quote:
Randy: "Demand is based firstly on price, and then on promotion and advertising which SH has admitted, has no financial connection to the producer."


Price is a function of demand, not the other way around. I never said advertising has no financial connection to the producer. That is another of your many damn lies.


Quote:
Randy: "Packers are willingly taking advantage of producer dollars to advertise while using every effort possible to pay the producer as little as possible for his cattle."


WHAT THE HELL DO YOU THINK JUST DROVE LIVE CATTLE PRICES TO A 50% ADVANCE IN A SINGLE YEAR IF CATTLE PRICES ARE NOT DRIVEN BY BEEF DEMAND????

You can't answer that!

Don't be such an idiot!


Quote:
Randy: "Call that integrated till the dogs come home SH, but it is the truth."


You don't know anything about truth.

Can't even comprehend your own words when you are irritated SH so how could you possibly comprhend someone else's words. Go get some medication to calm your packer lover mind.

Take me to that counter SH and show me that flank steak, and then take me to the ranch and show me how it made the rancher one red cent.
You cannot prove that increase in demand was brought on by the checkoff any more than you can prove Tyson and Cargill lost money due to the closed border.

You are more blinded by packer love than I am by packer blame any day.

The one I like the most on this name calling fluery of yours is the 50% advance in a single year statement. What the hell did that have to do with what I said just above. You are a lost sorry soul SH, hell bent on your packer loving mission, and bound to dispell anyone with name calling and intimidation. Yap on about BIG C you idiot, and then support a program with a lot of the same intentions. Anything for attention hey bud.

A peron should know better than to keep coming back here as SH will never grow up. Such a sorry excuse for a closet Liberal I have never seen.

Randy could you stop and think for a minute. The Beef Checkoff is for Research and Development. They research and develop ways to make cheaper cuts of beef sell for more money. They have develop prepared beef entrees so the lady of the house can still serve beef for supper even though she was at work all day. That convenience costs her alot more than than beef would have cost her if she cooked it herself. But to her it is worth it and it adds value to cheaper cuts of meat. They have also developed beef snacks that can be picked like any other snack food is in this fast pace world we live in. Have you ever figured out what a pound of beef snacks cost, there is big bucks in beef jerky. Another cheap cut selling for big bucks. Now tell us how can that not help the beef producer. Check Off is also used for advertizing beef to raise awareness about what beef has to offer. If people are more aware of what a great product we produce and they decide to eat more of it in the form of the convenience ways we as an industry are supplying it What happens Randy? The demand goes up, prices go up across the board, generally the supply and demand sets the price.
I also agree with Faster Horses If we don't advertize our product who will. I also agree that advertizing money does make a big difference on how your product is treated. Just look at what happens when a company threatens to pull their advertizing. People take note and correct whatever was the cause of the threat, the more the money involved the faster the problem is corrected.

 

[Sandhusker]

SH, "...Considering that 33% of our population is hispanic do you actually believe they would shy from Mexican beef while they fly their Mexican flags in the U.S.??"

I have observed something locally on that line. We have a number of Mexican nationals that provide seasonable labor at the local seed potato operation. On payday, they are sure to be at the bar where they come in for a few frosties and games of pool. Mexican beer is available, but I have never seen them drink anything other than Bud or Bud Light. Admittedly, this is only one example and you would have study all products that they use, but it is still notable.

 

[mrj]

Will any increase in the check-off be subject to a vote?

Do we need to get 10% of the beef producers to ask for this or what?

Is there a mechanism in place already for doing this?

Where can a person get answers to the above?

You can get answers to checkoff questions from [email protected]

MRJ

 

[Tam]

SH, "...Considering that 33% of our population is hispanic do you actually believe they would shy from Mexican beef while they fly their Mexican flags in the U.S.??"

I have observed something locally on that line. We have a number of Mexican nationals that provide seasonable labor at the local seed potato operation. On payday, they are sure to be at the bar where they come in for a few frosties and games of pool. Mexican beer is available, but I have never seen them drink anything other than Bud or Bud Light. Admittedly, this is only one example and you would have study all products that they use, but it is still notable.

Gee I thought the Mexicans working in the US sent their entire pay check back to Mexico and did nothing for the economy of the US. And here you are saying On payday, they are sure to be at the bar where they come in for a few frosties and games of pool and you have never seem then drink anything but US made beer. :?

 

[Sandhusker]

SH, "...Considering that 33% of our population is hispanic do you actually believe they would shy from Mexican beef while they fly their Mexican flags in the U.S.??"

I have observed something locally on that line. We have a number of Mexican nationals that provide seasonable labor at the local seed potato operation. On payday, they are sure to be at the bar where they come in for a few frosties and games of pool. Mexican beer is available, but I have never seen them drink anything other than Bud or Bud Light. Admittedly, this is only one example and you would have study all products that they use, but it is still notable.

Gee I thought the Mexicans working in the US sent their entire pay check back to Mexico and did nothing for the economy of the US. And here you are saying On payday, they are sure to be at the bar where they come in for a few frosties and games of pool and you have never seem then drink anything but US made beer. :?

Since you're part of the fray now, Tam, would you like to venture a guess as to what % of that check gets spent at the local watering hole and what % is wired home? :shock:

 

[mrj]

If we don't pay to advertise our product, who will?

I will tell you one thing for sure. Before the Checkoff, we got really bad press. Ladies magazines loved to rip beef apart. They could, and it didn't hurt them in the least because they lost no advertising because of it.

After the Checkoff when there was advertising dollars to be spent and money was spent with these magazines, they began to print more favorable articles about beef. That type of advertising, money can't buy. Oh yeah, we paid for ads, but the favorable press we got was a definite benefit.

Think about all those movie stars they interviewed that was dead-set against eating meat. The magazines were full of 'em. Heck, now you can read about movie stars that EAT meat. Drastic change, if you ask me.

BTW, Jacquline Smith is a BURGER GIRL. That's what she said in a national magazine. Talked about how she ate burgers and ate them several times a week. That my friends, is effective advertising. And no one PAID her to do it. But the magazine that printed what she said might not have done so, if not for the Beef Checkoff and advertising dollars.

So again, if we aren't going to pay for it, WHO WILL?

And ask NIKE and a few others if advertising pays.

Great points, FH!

BTW, along with that advertising, some of it showing consumers information about the superior nutrition of beef over chicken white meat and the comparable fat content, the Beef Checkoff also is conducting educational seminars with media people showing them the values and health benefits of beef as well as de-bunking the anti-beef myths that have been spread by some of the organizations that are working to end animal agriculture. Similar checkoff funded workshops train health professionals to use modern information re. beef and health.

The Beef Checkoff does far more than just advertise!

MRJ

 

[Econ101]

SH and Tam,
I think there is way too much confusion of your part in this marketing process of beef. The packers are not the consumers and your link to the retailer's dollar is way too far for you to benefit after going through the other people. Grain people don't get that big of a part of the retail dollar either. Unless you differentiate and have a processing plant where you control the retail product, these tactics will only cost you more money than you pay into them. With more packer concentration and "economies of scale" that may be harder and harder to do.

How many packers cut out an animal for the producer who is willing to do further processing and grab the retail dollar? From the posts, I would assume Rkaiser is one of them and Mike C. is another. It seems to me by just glancing at the industry that the USDA inspection service has been an impediment, not a facilitator of this type market structure. I know of USDA inspectors that are reportedly REAL impediments.

I admit I do not know about this part of the industry, that is why I am asking the questions.

 

[Anonymous]

Randy the packer blamer: "If the packers pay more, the producer will get less."

That's not what I said. I said if the packer incurs additional expense such as the beef checkoff, they will pass that expense on to the producer in the form of lower cattle prices just like any other expense that is added to this industry is past on to the producer.

Did you actually think packers would operate at a loss for your profitability? YOU DID?

Randy the packer blamer: "I'm surviving just fine in my ignorant uninformed world."

Obviously!



~SH~

 

[Econ101]

Randy the packer blamer: "If the packers pay more, the producer will get less."

That's not what I said. I said if the packer incurs additional expense such as the beef checkoff, they will pass that expense on to the producer in the form of lower cattle prices just like any other expense that is added to this industry is past on to the producer.

Did you actually think packers would operate at a loss for your profitability? YOU DID?

Randy the packer blamer: "I'm surviving just fine in my ignorant uninformed world."

Obviously!



~SH~

SH, the feeders are a part of the marketing channel just like the packers are. Why do big packers get the opportunity of always making their spread like you suggest and feeders do not? That view is not one of a competitive market. It is one where one part of the marketing channel has unusal power to enforce its spread.

 

[rancher]

Did you actually think packers would operate at a loss for your profitability? YOU DID?


What are the packers paying now and what is the profitabity of the packers now?? It comes down to supply and where they can get the lowest cost of that supply.

 

[Tam]

SH, "...Considering that 33% of our population is hispanic do you actually believe they would shy from Mexican beef while they fly their Mexican flags in the U.S.??"

I have observed something locally on that line. We have a number of Mexican nationals that provide seasonable labor at the local seed potato operation. On payday, they are sure to be at the bar where they come in for a few frosties and games of pool. Mexican beer is available, but I have never seen them drink anything other than Bud or Bud Light. Admittedly, this is only one example and you would have study all products that they use, but it is still notable.

Gee I thought the Mexicans working in the US sent their entire pay check back to Mexico and did nothing for the economy of the US. And here you are saying On payday, they are sure to be at the bar where they come in for a few frosties and games of pool and you have never seem then drink anything but US made beer. :?

Since you're part of the fray now, Tam, would you like to venture a guess as to what % of that check gets spent at the local watering hole and what % is wired home? :shock:

I have no idea what % is spent in the US wateringhole or on living expenses while they are living and working in the US. But can you tell me what % of the US payroll is spent in waterholes by Americans vacationing in Sunny Mexico? The Mexicans are not the only ones spenting their paychecks south of the border.
I have said before even though they may send part of their paycheck home to Mexico, They do affect the US economy with the % of their paycheck they have to use to live on while working in the US. It has been made to sound as if the 100% is sent back to Mexico and none of it is spent in the US economy. But as to your own comments about they are sure to be in the bar on payday buying US beer and playing pool means some of that money is staying in the US affecting the US economy. :roll:

 

[RobertMac]

What is the net market share change since the beginning of the check-off?

The bottom line for a promotional/advertising program is market share. The net market share for beef (1985-2003)...a lose of 10.3%.

It is one where one part of the marketing channel has unusual power to enforce its spread.

Packers turn a live animal into a usable, edible product...they are the connection to the consumer. All dollars come from the consumer. As long as they control market access, they don't have to control production if they can expand supply opportunities.

 

[rkaiser]

It is not that I don't believe in advertising Tam. I simply question the sytem in place in the Cattle/Beef industry. Does Ipsco steel advertise for Ford?

Come on you checkoff supporters, prove to us lame brains that our checkoff dollars are going back into producers pockets. Supply and demand all you want; that is no proof. Export tariffs and subsidies can change price in this industry faster and more dramatically than any switch from a flank steak back to a burger. AND that flank steak is not a bad idea. As well as anything else that has come from DEVELOPEMENT work.

According to SH, if the packers decided it was time to run some advertising of their own, they would simply take it from the producers pockets anyway so maybe I'm flogging a dead horse.

These producer groups collecting checkoff could do a lot better if they offered help and assistance rather than the whole ball of wax promoting beef for Cargill and Tyson.

Show me the money SH or Tam. Show me more than your opinion on how much good the checkoff advertising does for the producers of North America. You know me, I'm all about opionion and that's about it.

 

[Anonymous]

Kindergarten: "I think there is way too much confusion of your part in this marketing process of beef."

Hahaha! Listen to you! Nobody is more confused here than you are.

Kindergarten: "The packers are not the consumers and your link to the retailer's dollar is way too far for you to benefit after going through the other people."

Any and all new dollars into this industry will come from the consumer. To suggest that little of this value is passed on to the producer is to say that there is no competitition between the major packers. Another of your idiotic conclusions.

Kindergarten: "Grain people don't get that big of a part of the retail dollar either."

Too bad guys like you are so ignorant of the expenses between the producer and the consumer.

Kindergarten: "Unless you differentiate and have a processing plant where you control the retail product, these tactics will only cost you more money than you pay into them. With more packer concentration and "economies of scale" that may be harder and harder to do."

When consumer demand for beef goes up, live cattle prices go up. Consumer demand for beef is not going to go up unless you are adding value to your product and promoting it.

Kindergarten: "How many packers cut out an animal for the producer who is willing to do further processing and grab the retail dollar?"

Any producer can process their own beef if they have the desire and knowledge. Most find out the profits are not worth the expense unless it's done in an efficient and productive manner.

Kindergarten: "It seems to me by just glancing at the industry that the USDA inspection service has been an impediment, not a facilitator of this type market structure. I know of USDA inspectors that are reportedly REAL impediments."

A lot of things are different than they "SEEM TO BE" to the conspiring mind.

Kindergarten: "I admit I do not know about this part of the industry, that is why I am asking the questions."

That goes without saying but you are still making more bogus statements than asking legitimate questions.



~SH~