Just for you gunslinger

[rkaiser]

Same ole SH says all of this -

The timing between the resumption of boxed beef imports and R-CULT's injunction is a "red herring" to the fact that that R-CULT filed an injunction to stop the imports of Canadian live cattle, not boxed beef. It's also a "red herring" to the fact that the Canadian border being closed to live cattle was prolonged by R-CULT's actions.

A BETTER QUESTION RANDY IS HOW LONG DID THE CANADIAN BORDER STAY CLOSED AFTER IT WOULD HAVE BEEN OPENED DUE TO R-CULT'S INJUNCTION ?????

I can't believe you are so gracious to R-CULT that you would excuse their politically based injunction and blame USDA for something that was out of USDA's hands once it was brought into the court system.

What's your point anyway Randy? That USDA was going along with a Large Packer Conspiracy to screw Canadian producers? Is that what you really believe? In your constant packer blaming conspiracy mindset, you simply cannot accept the fact that Boise, Pasco, and many other northern plants that relied on those Canadian cattle NO LONGER HAD THOSE CANADIAN CATTLE. As has been pointed out by you numerous times, the same companies own plants on both sides of the border. What they gained in Canada they more than lost in the U.S. SO WHERE THE HELL'S THE INCENTIVE TO SCREW THE CANADIAN CATTLEMAN???? There is none. It's all in your conspiring mind.

In contrast, R-CULT certainly had the incentive to deceptively use BSE as a catalyst to stop Canadian live cattle imports

You are such a damn packer blamer that you simply cannot accept the truth

The truth is that R-CULT was successful in stabbing the Canadian producer in the back and using BSE as a catalyst to stop Canadian live cattle imports for an extended period of time due to their total ignorance of the impact of Canadian live cattle imports on our markets.

WE CAN SEE THE TRUTH NOW IN OUR MARKETS WITH AN OPENED BORDER CAN'T WE TOMMY????? Did you tell your R-CULT leaders that they were full of sh*t with their Canadian import blaming predictions or did you try to explain it off like the rest of the deceivers?

R-CULT filed an injunction with USDA to stop Canadian live cattle imports not out of a concern for BSE BUT TO STOP CANADIAN LIVE CATTLE IMPORTS.

The standard had already been set with their "LOST" dumping case.

Keep bowing that turbin Tommy! Wear those rose colored glasses so you don't have to view the deceptive truth about the pathetic organization you support.

Red Herring all right. No SH no conspiracy - just a simple opportunity to goo not to take advantage of. Just like I have said all along. How fast do you think the border would have opened to boxed beef had the packers in Canada had names like "Canada Packers", "Maple Leaf" or even "Ranchers New Generation Co-op"

No SH, the border opened to boxed beef because it was an easy fix and some easy moey for some American interests. It could have opened to live cattle at the same time, but that would have benefitted no one except the lowly Canadian Producer.

I have never excused Rcalf, gopher trapper, only pointed out how their protectionist wing is playing with a few cards short of a deck.

Have to cut and paste this one since it is a classic.
Gopher Trapper says -

In contrast, R-CULT certainly had the incentive to deceptively use BSE as a catalyst to stop Canadian live cattle imports

Then he says -

WE CAN SEE THE TRUTH NOW IN OUR MARKETS WITH AN OPENED BORDER CAN'T WE TOMMY?????

What was the incentive SH? :lol: :lol:

Sure would like you to tell me why the USDA opened the border to boxed beef and not live cattle SH? Without your Mr. science hat on of course.

 

[mrj]

Same ole SH says all of this -

The timing between the resumption of boxed beef imports and R-CULT's injunction is a "red herring" to the fact that that R-CULT filed an injunction to stop the imports of Canadian live cattle, not boxed beef. It's also a "red herring" to the fact that the Canadian border being closed to live cattle was prolonged by R-CULT's actions.

A BETTER QUESTION RANDY IS HOW LONG DID THE CANADIAN BORDER STAY CLOSED AFTER IT WOULD HAVE BEEN OPENED DUE TO R-CULT'S INJUNCTION ?????

I can't believe you are so gracious to R-CULT that you would excuse their politically based injunction and blame USDA for something that was out of USDA's hands once it was brought into the court system.

What's your point anyway Randy? That USDA was going along with a Large Packer Conspiracy to screw Canadian producers? Is that what you really believe? In your constant packer blaming conspiracy mindset, you simply cannot accept the fact that Boise, Pasco, and many other northern plants that relied on those Canadian cattle NO LONGER HAD THOSE CANADIAN CATTLE. As has been pointed out by you numerous times, the same companies own plants on both sides of the border. What they gained in Canada they more than lost in the U.S. SO WHERE THE HELL'S THE INCENTIVE TO SCREW THE CANADIAN CATTLEMAN???? There is none. It's all in your conspiring mind.

In contrast, R-CULT certainly had the incentive to deceptively use BSE as a catalyst to stop Canadian live cattle imports

You are such a damn packer blamer that you simply cannot accept the truth

The truth is that R-CULT was successful in stabbing the Canadian producer in the back and using BSE as a catalyst to stop Canadian live cattle imports for an extended period of time due to their total ignorance of the impact of Canadian live cattle imports on our markets.

WE CAN SEE THE TRUTH NOW IN OUR MARKETS WITH AN OPENED BORDER CAN'T WE TOMMY????? Did you tell your R-CULT leaders that they were full of sh*t with their Canadian import blaming predictions or did you try to explain it off like the rest of the deceivers?

R-CULT filed an injunction with USDA to stop Canadian live cattle imports not out of a concern for BSE BUT TO STOP CANADIAN LIVE CATTLE IMPORTS.

The standard had already been set with their "LOST" dumping case.

Keep bowing that turbin Tommy! Wear those rose colored glasses so you don't have to view the deceptive truth about the pathetic organization you support.

Red Herring all right. No SH no conspiracy - just a simple opportunity to goo not to take advantage of. Just like I have said all along. How fast do you think the border would have opened to boxed beef had the packers in Canada had names like "Canada Packers", "Maple Leaf" or even "Ranchers New Generation Co-op"

No SH, the border opened to boxed beef because it was an easy fix and some easy moey for some American interests. It could have opened to live cattle at the same time, but that would have benefitted no one except the lowly Canadian Producer.

I have never excused Rcalf, gopher trapper, only pointed out how their protectionist wing is playing with a few cards short of a deck.

Have to cut and paste this one since it is a classic.
Gopher Trapper says -

In contrast, R-CULT certainly had the incentive to deceptively use BSE as a catalyst to stop Canadian live cattle imports

Then he says -

WE CAN SEE THE TRUTH NOW IN OUR MARKETS WITH AN OPENED BORDER CAN'T WE TOMMY?????

What was the incentive SH? :lol: :lol:

Sure would like you to tell me why the USDA opened the border to boxed beef and not live cattle SH? Without your Mr. science hat on of course.

One reason, a very strong one and maybe the ONLY one, IMO, is the high number of ranchers out in the country who had swallowed the R-CALF propagandists' mantra saturating the ag media (mainly those dependent upon cattle auction market advertising dollars) over months of time that cattle prices would plummet if the border opened.......and those guys were instructed over and over and over to "call your Congressmen...get your 'legislatures' (Johnny Smith term) on the phone and tell them to keep this border closed if you don't want your cattle prices down with the Canadians'". The political action of the members probably carried more weight than we ever experienced before in agriculture and gave the leaders more political stature than they deserved, because it was so bogus and devolved from the mis-information so widely and strongly spread.

MRJ

 

[rkaiser]

Okee dokee, that's one vote for BWAME RCALF.

Next-

 

[Anonymous]

Sandbag: "Remember that little poll where the board was asked whether I proved you lied or not. If I remember correctly, it was a landslide that I proved you lied."

BWAHAHAHAHA!

The results of a poll of your lemming support group is your proof?

You bet Sandbag!

CREATE THE "ILLUSION" WITH THE RESULTS OF A WORTHLESS POLL OF YOUR PACKER BLAMING SUPPORT GROUP.

Proof is FACTUAL proof, not opinions of your support group of packer blaming clones! You didn't prove anything! You never prove anything! You couldn't even prove that Boise and Pasco didn't lose more money in Calendar year 2004 than Lakeside made. Agman and I HAD TO PROVE THAT. Agman agreed with my original statement but not calendar year 2004 and you thanked him for his honesty ONLY BECAUSE IT MEANT SO MUCH TO YOU TO WIN THE BET on calendar year 2004. I lost a bet based on my own willingness to admit my calendar year 2004 mistake and I paid up EVEN AFTER YOU SAID THE BET REVOLVED AROUND MY ORIGINAL STATEMENT which I could have sunk my teeth into to welch on what I had agreed to. Whooopdi do, a trophy on your mantle from my slip up on time and my willingness to admit I was wrong. WHAT A VICTORY FOR SANDBAG AND HIS PACKER BLAMING SUPPORT GROUP!!! Wave that banner proudly Sandbag because that's about all you'll ever get. The day you prove someone wrong with actual supporting facts is the day hell freezes over.


BRING ME THE PROOF THAT TYSON'S LAKESIDE PLANT MADE MORE MONEY WHILE THE BORDER WAS CLOSED THAN TYSON'S PASCO AND BOISE PLANTS LOST.

If you can't, YOU GOT NOTHING, AS USUAL!



Randy,

The opening of the Canadian border to boxed beef and not live cattle had nothing to do with U.S. benefits to the packers. That is absolutely untrue.

Randy: "How fast do you think the border would have opened to boxed beef had the packers in Canada had names like "Canada Packers", "Maple Leaf" or even "Ranchers New Generation Co-op"

Wouldn't have made a damn bit of difference. NONE!

The border would have opened to live cattle UNDER 30 MONTHS shortly after boxed beef but R-CULT muddied the waters wtih their phony injunction.

Randy: "No SH, the border opened to boxed beef because it was an easy fix and some easy moey for some American interests. It could have opened to live cattle at the same time, but that would have benefitted no one except the lowly Canadian Producer."

BULL!

That is your conspiring mind working overtime again. You have absolutely no proof of that and your conspiring mind simply will not accept the fact that the packers wanted the border opened to live cattle SINCE THEY WERE LOSING MORE MONEY IN PASCO AND BOISE THAN THEY WERE MAKING AT LAKESIDE. You don't want to believe that but you damn sure have nothing to support your conspiracy theory to the contrary.

Randy Kaiser: "What was the incentive SH?"

The actual incentive or the "PERCEIVED" incentive by R-CULT?

The "PERCEIVED" incentive by R-CULT was that Canadian live cattle imports were crushing our markets. THEY WERE WRONG but that is still what they believed.

The short term immediate incentive would have been about a 6% advance in the price of fat cattle. Certainly not worth stabbing Canadian producers in the back for.

The actual LONG TERM incentive would have been ABSOLUTELY NOTHING since Canadian live cattle would have competed with U.S. cattle on the global market. Something the average R-CULTer is too narrow minded to understand.

There was very little incentive BUT R-CULT CAN'T SEE THE INDUSTRY PAST THE BACK OF A CANADIAN POTLOAD OF FAT CATTLE OR FEEDERS AND THEY GREATLY EXAGGERATE THE IMPACT OF CANADIAN CATTLE BECAUSE THEY SIMPLY DON'T KNOW ANY BETTER. THEY ARE BLAMERS!

Chisel that in stone!

Randy: "Sure would like you to tell me why the USDA opened the border to boxed beef and not live cattle SH? Without your Mr. science hat on of course."

WHY DON'T YOU ASK THEM RANDY????

DON'T YOU WANT TO HEAR IT FROM THE HORSE'S MOUTH???

WHY DO YOU WANT ME TO ANSWER FOR USDA'S DECISION?????

You don't want to know the truth, that's why. You'd rather go on believing it was a conspiracy to allow packers access to the U.S. boxed beef market while mantaining a stituation in Canada of more cattle than slaughter capacity WHILE THOSE CATTLE WERE NO LONGER AVAILABLE IN U.S. PACKING PLANTS.

Forget the fact that AMI filed an amicus brief to open the border. Randy thinks that was a smokescreen.

ASK USDA RANDY! ASK THEM! FIND OUT THE TRUTH FOR ONCE INSTEAD OF BATHING IN YOUR SELF PITY!

RK: "Okee dokee, that's one vote for BWAME RCALF."

WHAT MRJ SAID WAS A FACT!

These guys spread their import impact bullsh*t far and wide. They have greatly exaggerated the impact of Canadian live cattle imports but they won't admit it with all that egg on their faces now.


~SH~

 

[rkaiser]

What's the conspiracy SH?

All that I am saying is that their was an opportunity and the USDA took it.

Just like the opportunity taken by the packers in Canada.

They say that people who use words a lot, think like their words. Is the world out to get you SH. Am I conspiring against you. 8)

The USDA saw a chance to open the border to boxed beef. They chose this route, as I say, due to the fact that it would not hurt American interests; packers, producers, or consumers.

If you need to ask the USDA and get that very answer SH, it's up to you. A mindless packer follower like yourself could think for yourself for once, but the chances of that are pretty slim aren't they.

I'll take that as 2 votes for "BWAME RCALF" for the border not opening to live cattle when it opened to boxed beef.

Any more packer lovers want to get on the blame wagon?

 

[Anonymous]

As expected!

You don't want to know the truth about USDA's decision Randy. You want to go on believing a conspiracy that,

"The USDA saw a chance to open the border to boxed beef. They chose this route, as I say, due to the fact that it would not hurt American interests; packers, producers, or consumers."

Your own words!

If you wanted to know why USDA opened the border to boxed beef prior to live cattle, all you would have to do is ask them but you won't.........

RK: "If you need to ask the USDA and get that very answer SH, it's up to you."

If the USDA wanted to open the border to boxed beef and not to live cattle there would have been no reason for R-CULT to file the injunction and the border would still be closed to live cattle wouldn't it? WOULDN'T IT?????? If the justification was there to keep the border closed to live cattle, the border would still be closed to live cattle. ONCE AGAIN, THE OBVIOUS IS SIMPLY TOO OBVIOUS FOR A PACKER BLAMER LIKE YOU RANDY!

American packers were being hurt by the closed Canadian border because they didn't have Canadian cattle for many of their northern plants. A fact you simply cannot get through your thick head.


USDA'S DECISION ON WHEN TO OPEN THE CANADIAN BORDER TO LIVE CATTLE IN COMPARISON TO BOXED BEEF WAS BASED ON THE TIME IT TOOK TO DETERMINE THE LEVEL OF RISK THEY FELT EACH POSED.

When R-CULT got word that the border was going to open to Canadian live cattle, shortly after boxed beef imports resumed, that is when R-CULT filed their phony injunction to stop the importation of live cattle.


~SH~

 

[rkaiser]

:lol: :lol:

You're the best SH.

Do you really think that typing in capital letters and then making them bold, will make me understand your packer puppet point of view.

Gopher trapper says

USDA'S DECISION ON WHEN TO OPEN THE CANADIAN BORDER TO LIVE CATTLE IN COMPARISON TO BOXED BEEF WAS BASED ON THE TIME IT TOOK TO DETERMINE THE LEVEL OF RISK THEY FELT EACH POSED.

:lol: :lol:

And you think I'm a dreamer.

Like I keep saying SH, capitalism at it's finest. I know it's hard for a closet commi like you to understand. USDA made a bold move and it paid off for America.

 

[Anonymous]

Believe what you want to believe Randy. To hell with facts and truth.

RANDY NEEDS SOMEONE TO BLAME...........


~SH~

 

[rkaiser]

Facts and truth hey SH! :lol:

SH doesn't blame anybody EXCEPT anybody who doesn't agree with his ass kissing packer bias.

 

[Sandhusker]

SH, "BRING ME THE PROOF THAT TYSON'S LAKESIDE PLANT MADE MORE MONEY WHILE THE BORDER WAS CLOSED THAN TYSON'S PASCO AND BOISE PLANTS LOST. "

I never made a statement saying they did.

SH, "Fact: Tyson lost more money in their U.S. plants than they gained in Canada WHILE THE U.S. BORDER WAS CLOSED TO CANADIAN LIVE CATTLE IMPORTS. PROVE ME WRONG CHEAP TALKER!!! Watch the babble and diversion....................... I was only wrong within calendar year 2004. That was my only mistake. My original statement stands as written and it will remain standing as written."

OK, fine then. Lets make another bet - double or nothing. My $100 to NCBA vs your $100 to R-CALF says that you can't prove your original statement, either. Bring some numbers, old boy.

 

[Anonymous]

SH (previous): ""BRING ME THE PROOF THAT TYSON'S LAKESIDE PLANT MADE MORE MONEY WHILE THE BORDER WAS CLOSED THAN TYSON'S PASCO AND BOISE PLANTS LOST."

Sandbag (in response): "I never made a statement saying they did."

Then how could I have lied when I said that Tyson's Boise and Pasco plants lost more money WHILE THE BORDER WAS CLOSED than Tyson's Lakeside plant made?

I'll take that as your admission that you can't provide any proof that I lied.

Sandbag: "OK, fine then. Lets make another bet - double or nothing. My $100 to NCBA vs your $100 to R-CALF says that you can't prove your original statement, either. Bring some numbers, old boy.'

You are the one who said you had proof that I lied. Bring it!

Bring the numbers to prove that I lied.


Watch the dance folks...............



~SH~

 

[Tommy]

SH...Keep bowing that turbin Tommy! Wear those rose colored glasses so you don't have to view the deceptive truth about the pathetic organization you support.

Scott I am not the one who is lying, you are? The USDA had no plans to open the border to live cattle at the same time boxed beef was opened. You know that, but had to spin in a way so that R-CALF was blamed. You are the pathetic one anymore Scott.

 

[mrj]

It appears that no one has any explanation of the reasons R-CALF cheerleaders went to all the effort and expense of publicly urging members to contact their Congressional delegation demanding they keep the border closed during that time frame.

The cause and effect seems pretty obvious.

MRJ

 

[Sandhusker]

SH, "Then how could I have lied when I said that Tyson's Boise and Pasco plants lost more money WHILE THE BORDER WAS CLOSED than Tyson's Lakeside plant made?"

You're lying because you're stating as fact (as nauseum) what you can not possibly know. I've got a $100 that says you can't prove it. Want to donate to R-CALF again?

 

[Tommy]

mj...It appears that no one has any explanation of the reasons R-CALF cheerleaders went to all the effort and expense of publicly urging members to contact their Congressional delegation demanding they keep the border closed during that time frame.


mj the border was to be opened to live cattle under 30 months of age Mar.7 2005. R-CALF filed an injunction that kept that from happening on that date. It did open to those cattle on or around July 18 2005. What Scott has said that it would have been open to live cattle at the same time it was for boxed beef if not for R-CALF is a lie.

 

[Anonymous]

T: "Scott I am not the one who is lying, you are? The USDA had no plans to open the border to live cattle at the same time boxed beef was opened. You know that, but had to spin in a way so that R-CALF was blamed. You are the pathetic one anymore Scott."

If USDA hadn't planned on opening the border to live cattle shortly after boxed beef, WHY DID R-CULT FILE THE INJUNCTION??? Who do you think your kidding Tommy? The time frame between the resumption of boxed beef imports and live cattle imports would have been minimal and basically irrelevant if not for R-CULT's injunction and that's a damn fact. If you have anything to the contrary, BRING IT! PROVE IT! BACK YOUR POSITION! You won't! You R-CULT clones never back your positions you just make cheap statements and call people liars that don't support your blaming position.

You can't seem to accept the consequences of your pathetic organization stabbing the Canadian producers in the back so you try to spin the blame off on USDA???

Imports of Canadian live cattle under 24 months would have resumed shortly after boxed beef imports had R-CULT not filed their phony injunction. That is a fact!

Sandbag: "You're lying because you're stating as fact (as nauseum) what you can not possibly know. I've got a $100 that says you can't prove it. Want to donate to R-CALF again?"

Then Agman is lying too and you thanked him for his honesty when he agreed with me on the time period the border was closed.

You couldn't possibly know whether or not I was lying unless you had the facts to the contrary. WHERE IS YOUR PROOF TO THE CONTRARY? You claim that I lied simply because I didn't prove MY STATEMENT to your satisfaction. You didn't accept the fact that Boise and Pasco were running at 35% of capacity. You didn't accept the fact that Tyson reported Lakeside actually losing money at the beginning of calendar year 2005. You didn't accept the fact that Lakeside had the cost of SRM removal. You didn't accept the word of the Tyson representative I talked to. You didn't accept the total slaughter capacity numbers Agman presented for Pasco and Boise in relation to the slaughter numbers I presented for Lakeside.

To heck with you! YOU PROVE THAT I LIED or you are the damn liar.

First you said I lied, then you said I didn't, then you said I may have, and now you say I lied again. A true liar always changes his story. I can't wait for the day that you call me a liar to my face you worthless parasite!


~SH~

 

[Anonymous]

YOU HYPOCRIT-- SH..--- You scream PROVE IT, but then when Sandhusker or someone else asks you to prove one of your so-called "facts" you run in circles and say YOU don't have to....

I still say R-CALF owes you the membership recruitment award- you have convinced more of us than any other one person that I know :wink: :lol:

Oh by the way--Did you notice what most buyers were asking for this year in preperation for trade with the export countries- AFFIDAVITS with a SIGNATURE? You remember those things that you said were worthless and couldn't be used for M-COOL....

Apparently the Asians trust ranchers a lot more than you do....

 

[rkaiser]

Gopher trapper's opinion is -

Imports of Canadian live cattle under 24 months would have resumed shortly after boxed beef imports had R-CULT not filed their phony injunction. That is a fact!

The real fact is that Imports of Canadian live cattle under 24 months should have resumed at the same time as boxed beef imports.

The only reason that this did not happen is fully economic. No science will do SH.

Opening to boxed beef was an opportunity for the USDA to benefit the American consumer, SOME American packers, and not harm the American producer.

 

[Sandhusker]

Are you thru yet? Do we have a bet or not?

 

[Anonymous]

I'll pay R-CULT $100 if you can provide the proof that I lied when I said that "Tyson's Boise and Pasco plants lost more money while the Canadian border was closed to live cattle than Tyson's Lakeside plant made".

You pay NCBA $100 if I provide the proof AGAIN to support the above statement.

Those are the terms!



~SH~