Oldtimer--Who will lead us into the future?

[Ben Roberts]

Oldtimer, in 2002 I wrote a book for cattlemen like yourself. I was going to print and bind that book, and gift it to R-CALF, for a means of increasing their membership. Before, I finished the book I called R-CALF and talked to John Locke, I ask him, "what has R-CALF done for its members, since they started", John told me that "R-CALF had brought a legal action against Canadian cattle coming into the US. and that action had increased the US fat cattle market $8.00 per hundred wt". I knew then that I was not going to gift my book to R-CALF, because that was just not true. That action did unfairly cost the cattle producers of Canada several million dollars though.

After I finished the book, I was in Philip, South Dakota visiting with Leo and Dennis about the future of the cattle industry, and Leo bought one of the books, two days later I had a message on my phone from Leo, saying "Ben best book ever,when I get back to Billings I want to order one for all the media people I know". he never called. It's beause of my position on the Canadian border and M-COOL that I will not change for R-CALF, or anyone else.

Oldtimer, you say that in Montana the largest percentage of beef in the retail stores is Canadian beef, does that really surprise you, how far is Billings, Helena or Great Falls Montana from Brooks or High River Alberta, would you rather pay the freight from Nebraska? It's the same on the East side of the country, Montreal, Quebec and Toronto are all closer to Michigan and Pennsylvania, than they are Alberta. Do you want to close that market for the American cattle producers?

We live in a global economy,like it or not Oldtimer, with cattle numbers world-wide one billion thirty five million head. Beef cattle numbers world-wide two hundred twenty four million head, with China having 29% of those, Brazil 21% and the United States at 15% of the total. Now it makes sense to me, that if we could combine our cattle numbers with Canada, we would both have a better position on the world market. We have four Major packers in the world, Tyson/IBP, Swift/Con-Agra, Cargill and soon to be the largest Smithfield. Those four packers are going to service the red meat demand, in the world, from some country, not from Montana or Washington state.

What, ever happened to the farmer/rancher spirit that stood at the end of the Concord bridge, and said THUS FAR AND NO FARTHER Oldertimer, if R-CALF is to lead us into the future, then why don't they, if you believe that going to Washington D.C. shows leadership,your wrong, anyone can go to Washington D.C. Do you really want your future in the hands of those senators, that you have talked about and get letters from? I don't, I want my future in my hands. The cattle industry needs organized leadership world-wide.

Best Regards
Ben Roberts

comments & criticism welcome

 

[Anonymous]

Well Ben I guess I go deeper...I consider myself a Jeffersonian Libertarian-- and I believe like Jefferson did that we should be promoting our own countrys products first- and utilizing those products that we can make locally even if they can be sourced out of country cheaper- that we should not be importing products that we do/or have the capability to produce ourselves....We should only import what we need and don't have available in this nation-- and export those things that we have a surplus of....

As a history buff- and having seen how history repeats itself many times over---I fear this dependence on the global market for necessities and food -- since it was shown that we won two world wars, not because we have braver soldiers or better fighters, but because we had greater industrial and agricultural assets and could feed and equip not only our own troops, but those of the entire allied forces....

M-COOL to me is not the making of new law-- it is filling the loopholes in the rule/law that governs the use of the USDA stamp and labels--that the multinational Packers/Retailers have found they can utilize to profit off of by misleading and defrauding the US consumers...It is also filling loopholes that were left in some badly written NAFTA, AFTA, CAFTA, etc, trade agreements that were purposely intended to benefit the Big Corporate interests....

I can't see how anyone can be against telling the US consumer the truth about where the food he eats comes from :???:

 

[Sandhusker]

Things have changed, Ben. We're heading to a world where no producers of any country will have any power - it will all lie in the hands of the packers you listed. We're already seeing that here in the US and in Canada. These same packers who control 90% of Canada and 80% of the US are expanding globally. Tyson brags that they're in something like 81 countries now. You then also take into consideration the consolidation of the packers and we're on the road to having one or two major packers controlling all the beef in the world.

This is being excellerated via the empty promise of "free trade". Free trade is being sold as a means to where anybody in the world can sell to anybody in the world and everybody profits because of it. The reality is that we are only opening chanels to the big multi-corps so they can arbitrage global supplies. The little guys get swallowed up and stepped on - look at Creekstone. All we will have left is Tyson and Cargill moving beef from the cheapest source to the highest market, wherever in the world either are located. Producers in every country lose, especially here. We will never be the low-cost producer.

So we team up with Canada, where does that get us? It will just be Tyson North America "competing" with Tyson Brazil! There's no competition there. Nothing will happen unless Tyson wants it to. For example, we won't move a roast to the EU if they're a penny cheaper in Brazil. What do you think the odds of that will be?

You don't want your future to be in the hands of those Senators, but do you feel more comfortable with your future in the hands of Tyson and Cargill? R-CALF is the only organization that I have heard that recognizes we're being led down the wrong path. The other guys are in bed with the packers.

 

[mwj]

Why don't we just shut the border to ALL BEEF from all countries. We can grind those chucks and rounds to use the 50/50 trim and run a special at walmart to use up the tounges, tripe, lips, kidneys and livers. The price will shoot up at the meatcase and all of us will get rich on cattle. Those burger places will all get in a price war to buy our red white and blue hamburger and all of our pro mcool consumers will stand in line to buy it. The poultry and pork growers will go broke and all will be good in the world 8) Oldtimer how many loads of hearts and tounges do you supose your butcher can move since they will all be safe and not from some bse ridden country? :wink:

 

[Ben Roberts]

Well Ben I guess I go deeper...I consider myself a Jeffersonian Libertarian-- and I believe like Jefferson did that we should be promoting our own countrys products first- and utilizing those products that we can make locally even if they can be sourced out of country cheaper- that we should not be importing products that we do/or have the capability to produce ourselves....We should only import what we need and don't have available in this nation-- and export those things that we have a surplus of...


Oldtimer, I just went to the barn and looked around, most of the items I need are imported. Export items that we have a surplus of ... leads into my next answer.


As a history buff- and having seen how history repeats itself many times over---I fear this dependence on the global market for necessities and food -- since it was shown that we won two world wars, not because we have braver soldiers or better fighters, but because we had greater industrial and agricultural assets and could feed and equip not only our own troops, but those of the entire allied forces....



I'm a history buff myself Oldtimer, we exported surplus steel to Japan, and they sent it back to us 12/07/1941. Today though the steel in my shop is from China. US steel mills are gone. If you had to make a guess, who would you say is supplying meat, to our troops and allied troops now?



M-COOL to me is not the making of new law-- it is filling the loopholes in the rule/law that governs the use of the USDA stamp and labels--that the multinational Packers/Retailers have found they can utilize to profit off of by misleading and defrauding the US consumers...It is also filling loopholes that were left in some badly written NAFTA, AFTA, CAFTA, etc, trade agreements that were purposely intended to benefit the Big Corporate interests....

I can't see how anyone can be against telling the US consumer the truth about where the food he eats comes from :???:

I can't understand that myself. Tell them, this calf was born in the US sold to a feeder in Canada, sold to a packer in the US and then to a retailer in the US. Like i've said before i'm not against it , I just don't see significance in it.

 

[Anonymous]

Well Ben-Around here-- Except for one two year period- about 99 or 2000-- you could count on your fingers the number of trucks with calves going north-- while the ones heading south would be running you off the road....

 

[Soapweed]

I can't see how anyone can be against telling the US consumer the truth about where the food he eats comes from :???:

The only things that matter to the consumer are price and taste. That is where their loyalties lie, no more no less. There is too much home-raised USA beef that is not that great. Beef from branded programs is another matter entirely. If a consumer gets great quality and taste every time, then a brand name carries clout. It is programs such as these where we need to spend our efforts. There is no use touting "Beef, born and raised in the USA," because it is only commodity beef bringing commodity prices.

 

[Anonymous]

Sandcheska: "Things have changed, Ben. We're heading to a world where no producers of any country will have any power - it will all lie in the hands of the packers you listed. We're already seeing that here in the US and in Canada. These same packers who control 90% of Canada and 80% of the US are expanding globally. Tyson brags that they're in something like 81 countries now. You then also take into consideration the consolidation of the packers and we're on the road to having one or two major packers controlling all the beef in the world.

This is being excellerated via the empty promise of "free trade". Free trade is being sold as a means to where anybody in the world can sell to anybody in the world and everybody profits because of it. The reality is that we are only opening chanels to the big multi-corps so they can arbitrage global supplies. The little guys get swallowed up and stepped on - look at Creekstone. All we will have left is Tyson and Cargill moving beef from the cheapest source to the highest market, wherever in the world either are located. Producers in every country lose, especially here. We will never be the low-cost producer.

So we team up with Canada, where does that get us? It will just be Tyson North America "competing" with Tyson Brazil! There's no competition there. Nothing will happen unless Tyson wants it to. For example, we won't move a roast to the EU if they're a penny cheaper in Brazil. What do you think the odds of that will be?

You don't want your future to be in the hands of those Senators, but do you feel more comfortable with your future in the hands of Tyson and Cargill? R-CALF is the only organization that I have heard that recognizes we're being led down the wrong path. The other guys are in bed with the packers."

And now
the end is near
and so I face
the final curtain.

poor me
We're all doomed
There's no hope
Join R-CALF today.

Hahaha!


Highest feeder cattle prices ever recorded in the fall of 2005 with an opened Canadian border, Packers at the same concentration levels, and the same number of captive supplies.

Cow Calf Producers and feeders buy out the 4th largest packer and now own the company.

BUT WE'RE ALL DOOMED!

POOR POOR LITTLE SANDCHESKA!



~SH~

 

[Anonymous]

Ben: "Before, I finished the book I called R-CALF and talked to John Locke, I ask him, "what has R-CALF done for its members, since they started", John told me that "R-CALF had brought a legal action against Canadian cattle coming into the US. and that action had increased the US fat cattle market $8.00 per hundred wt". I knew then that I was not going to gift my book to R-CALF, because that was just not true."

Leaves quite an impression doesn't it?



~SH~

 

[Anonymous]

I can't see how anyone can be against telling the US consumer the truth about where the food he eats comes from :???:

The only things that matter to the consumer are price and taste. That is where their loyalties lie, no more no less. There is too much home-raised USA beef that is not that great. Beef from branded programs is another matter entirely. If a consumer gets great quality and taste every time, then a brand name carries clout. It is programs such as these where we need to spend our efforts. There is no use touting "Beef, born and raised in the USA," because it is only commodity beef bringing commodity prices.

I disagree Soap-- If it all had to be labeled so folks knew there was foreign beef being passed off I think many would pick the US product...I would....There are still a lot of folks that believe in the USA and buy USA even if they have to pay more for it-- which was shown by the lobbyist money spent on Delay and Burns etal to change the law so that the Chinese could pass off products made in the Chinese owned factories in the Muriana's with a USA label... If its not worth anything why did they fight so hard and pay so much to get the law?

Then there are the health issues with the enviromental, chemical, and pharmaceutical pollution and exposure problems and several news and OIG reports of unsanitary slaughter conditions in Mexico/Central and South America...Tie in Canada's continuing BSE problem- it makes many want to have the choice of where the food they eat comes from....

What is happening now is a FRAUD....

 

[Anonymous]

I don't, I want my future in my hands. The cattle industry needs organized leadership world-wide.

Best Regards
Ben Roberts

comments & criticism welcome

Ben- And who do you suggest that can give that leadership?

 

[Ben Roberts]

I don't, I want my future in my hands. The cattle industry needs organized leadership world-wide.

Best Regards
Ben Roberts

comments & criticism welcome

Ben- And who do you suggest that can give that leadership?

Oldtimer,it's time the cattle producers, take back, the control of their industry. Without government intervention, we have no one to blame but ourselves. USPB, Oregon Country Beef and others on both sides of the border are doing it.

In answer to your question Oldtimer, We are the only ones that can lead our industry into the future.

 

[HAY MAKER]

Ben Roberts..........forget about this globilization theory,it's the ruination of the beef industry,as there aint a damned thing that is not bred born and raised in the good ole USA that is needed...........good luck

 

[Tam]

I can't see how anyone can be against telling the US consumer the truth about where the food he eats comes from :???:

The only things that matter to the consumer are price and taste. That is where their loyalties lie, no more no less. There is too much home-raised USA beef that is not that great. Beef from branded programs is another matter entirely. If a consumer gets great quality and taste every time, then a brand name carries clout. It is programs such as these where we need to spend our efforts. There is no use touting "Beef, born and raised in the USA," because it is only commodity beef bringing commodity prices.

I disagree Soap-- If it all had to be labeled so folks knew there was foreign beef being passed off I think many would pick the US product...I would....There are still a lot of folks that believe in the USA and buy USA even if they have to pay more for it-- which was shown by the lobbyist money spent on Delay and Burns etal to change the law so that the Chinese could pass off products made in the Chinese owned factories in the Muriana's with a USA label... If its not worth anything why did they fight so hard and pay so much to get the law?

Then there are the health issues with the enviromental, chemical, and pharmaceutical pollution and exposure problems and several news and OIG reports of unsanitary slaughter conditions in Mexico/Central and South America...Tie in Canada's continuing BSE problem- it makes many want to have the choice of where the food they eat comes from....

What is happening now is a FRAUD....

Tell us Oldtimer how did Walmart become the largest retailer in the US?

1. By selling US labeled products to loyal US consumers.
OR
2. By selling the customer what they want at a price they can afford.

Walmarts success shows how much loyality there really is to US product when price is in the picture. :wink:

 

[Ben Roberts]

Ben: "Before, I finished the book I called R-CALF and talked to John Locke, I ask him, "what has R-CALF done for its members, since they started", John told me that "R-CALF had brought a legal action against Canadian cattle coming into the US. and that action had increased the US fat cattle market $8.00 per hundred wt". I knew then that I was not going to gift my book to R-CALF, because that was just not true."

Leaves quite an impression doesn't it?



~SH~

Scott, yes! it left quite an impresion with me. Alot of my friends are members of R-CALF and/or NCBA, because they won't help themselves and they are looking for leadership.

Ben Roberts

 

[Sandhusker]

I can't see how anyone can be against telling the US consumer the truth about where the food he eats comes from :???:

The only things that matter to the consumer are price and taste. That is where their loyalties lie, no more no less. There is too much home-raised USA beef that is not that great. Beef from branded programs is another matter entirely. If a consumer gets great quality and taste every time, then a brand name carries clout. It is programs such as these where we need to spend our efforts. There is no use touting "Beef, born and raised in the USA," because it is only commodity beef bringing commodity prices.

The problem is that most of our beef is commodity beef and will probably remain as such. It's commodity beef that pays the bills in our industry. What are we going to wish we had done when, down the road, Brazil has an open door to our markets and all the limits with other beef exporting countries have fallen away? You mention price - there's no way we can compete with price, no way. I maintain that we are going to wish we had instilled some consumer loyalty. If we don't do something now, there's no doubt we'll get eaten up by the imports that will be coming.

 

[Anonymous]

The only things that matter to the consumer are price and taste. That is where their loyalties lie, no more no less. There is too much home-raised USA beef that is not that great. Beef from branded programs is another matter entirely. If a consumer gets great quality and taste every time, then a brand name carries clout. It is programs such as these where we need to spend our efforts. There is no use touting "Beef, born and raised in the USA," because it is only commodity beef bringing commodity prices.

I disagree Soap-- If it all had to be labeled so folks knew there was foreign beef being passed off I think many would pick the US product...I would....There are still a lot of folks that believe in the USA and buy USA even if they have to pay more for it-- which was shown by the lobbyist money spent on Delay and Burns etal to change the law so that the Chinese could pass off products made in the Chinese owned factories in the Muriana's with a USA label... If its not worth anything why did they fight so hard and pay so much to get the law?

Then there are the health issues with the enviromental, chemical, and pharmaceutical pollution and exposure problems and several news and OIG reports of unsanitary slaughter conditions in Mexico/Central and South America...Tie in Canada's continuing BSE problem- it makes many want to have the choice of where the food they eat comes from....

What is happening now is a FRAUD....

Tell us Oldtimer how did Walmart become the largest retailer in the US?

1. By selling US labeled products to loyal US consumers.
OR
2. By selling the customer what they want at a price they can afford.

Walmarts success shows how much loyality there really is to US product when price is in the picture. :wink:

And what did the folks choose when given the chance to buy US origin shrimp and seafood with the implementation of M-COOL on seafood? ....Last article I saw said that several Walmart stores had quit stocking the foreign product because the customers wanted the stuff with the USA label...

Part of the popularity of the Walmart concept is that they have so many varying items- part of the instant generations desire to buy everything from furniture to farm supplies in one stop....

 

[Tam]

Ben Roberts..........forget about this globilization theory,it's the ruination of the beef industry,as there aint a damned thing that is not bred born and raised in the good ole USA that is needed...........good luck

Forget about globalization Haymaker, I guess the US doesn't need all the crude, Canada sends down across the line to heat your homes and feed your growing energy needs. Or did you forget Canada is your largest supplier of crude? :wink: We'll just cut all global trade Beef, crude, natural gas, electricity, lumber with the US and see how you can handle your needs. As you always say Haymaker GOOD LUCK :wink:

 

[Ben Roberts]

Ben Roberts..........forget about this globilization theory,it's the ruination of the beef industry,as there aint a damned thing that is not bred born and raised in the good ole USA that is needed...........good luck

HAY MAKER, you just went up my ladder of respect. You are correct. I told my wife fifteen years ago, we will see the day, when our beef is not a marketable commodity in the US. I can't forget about the globilization theory, because it's not theory, it's reality. All the more reason why, we need to take back, the control of our industry.

Ben Roberts

 

[Tam]

I disagree Soap-- If it all had to be labeled so folks knew there was foreign beef being passed off I think many would pick the US product...I would....There are still a lot of folks that believe in the USA and buy USA even if they have to pay more for it-- which was shown by the lobbyist money spent on Delay and Burns etal to change the law so that the Chinese could pass off products made in the Chinese owned factories in the Muriana's with a USA label... If its not worth anything why did they fight so hard and pay so much to get the law?

Then there are the health issues with the enviromental, chemical, and pharmaceutical pollution and exposure problems and several news and OIG reports of unsanitary slaughter conditions in Mexico/Central and South America...Tie in Canada's continuing BSE problem- it makes many want to have the choice of where the food they eat comes from....

What is happening now is a FRAUD....

Tell us Oldtimer how did Walmart become the largest retailer in the US?

1. By selling US labeled products to loyal US consumers.
OR
2. By selling the customer what they want at a price they can afford.

Walmarts success shows how much loyalty there really is to US product when price is in the picture. :wink:

And what did the folks choose when given the chance to buy US origin shrimp and seafood with the implementation of M-COOL on seafood? ....Last article I saw said that several Walmart stores had quit stocking the foreign product because the customers wanted the stuff with the USA label...

Part of the popularity of the Walmart concept is that they have so many varying items- part of the instant generations desire to buy everything from furniture to farm supplies in one stop....

Doesn't speak well for their loyalty if they are not willing to drive down the road to buy a US labeled item does it? Convenience and price out weighs loyalty how many times if Walmart is the largest retailer in the US? :?