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Ranch update and Stocker question

J

JRDbuilt

Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2008
Messages
24
Location
Atlanta, GA tre
Well guys it looks like I will be closing soon on the ranch talked about in the other thread I started but wanted to start another topic to hopefully get the same great knowledge and advice as the other.

It was recommended multiple times to do a stocker system on the property to get my feet wet and get a feel for things and eventually move into what id like to do as in direct sale.

My questions-

What weight should i be looking at when I go to buy cattle? and what kind of current prices are these calfs going for?

thanks again!
CJ
 
Here in South Dakota 5 weight steers are in the $120's and 6 weight steers are in the teens. I suppose 4 weight steers would be in the 130's. Don't know if that info will do you any good where you are at.
 
Sounds like a gamble to me JRD. You buy $40-80,000 worth of stockers and gamble that the price will be profitable in the fall. Lots of people do it, and some actually make money at it, it's just too risky for my liking.

I'd feel safer custom grazing 100 or 200 stockers for someone else. You charge 85-90 cents / head / day, it's their risk, and you just get a cheque for pasturing them. 200 head X 90 cents X 150 days = $27,000.

Don't remember what you said the land would carry, but that's a safer option than buying stockers yourself and gambling in the cattle markets. Calf prices on your side of the border are high right now - never a good time to buy in my opinion.
 
purecountry,

I do really like the idea you mentioned. But how would I go about finding an individual that would want that sort of thing?

also,

I see the prices ( been researching reports and local stockyard reports like its the holy bible haha) and have always noticed the prices being higher this time of year which my guess would be that its because people are buying and less in the fall and yet again my guess would be people selling. My property is set up with rye / winter grasses so I wouldnt have to hay in the winter.

If I bought in the fall and til a year for the next spring ( had the cattle for 18 months) would I yield a better return from my cattle? the buy low sell high mentality.

thanks again guys!!
 
I think you'll have trouble finding somebody to run light cattle for without any experience. And you need to talk to people closer to you to find out more of the specifics about local market conditions and the gain to expect in your area. Some of the guys further west in shortgrass country can still be laying on two pounds a day at the end of the season when you and I will have greener looking grass and be lucky to keep cattle from going backwards. Find somebody in your area that runs light calves to see what they can do all through the summer.

I agree that it's not a good time to be starting out because of the price of calves. You might try putting your cattle together in the fall when they're usually cheaper and the runs are big. Rough winter them with not much expense and they'll be ready to turn around quick once spring gets here. You might not get but 1/2 or 3/4 of a pound gain over the winter, but it won't cost you much and the calves will be a lot cheaper going in, too.

If I was just starting out, I'd try to buy in during the big fall runs. Buy the mismanaged, upgrading kind of calves or cutting bulls that somebody else didn't want to spend any time with. Those kind of calves that aren't weaned and need dehorning, castrating, shots and tlc will make some money, but you have GOT to be ready to spend time with them. Those bigger cutting bulls in thin flesh will make you fifty or sixty bucks their first trip through the chute. And once they get straightened out, they'll gain really well, too.

Try to have them ready to sell by August or September because there's nothing much better to have for sale than a late summer yearling. Be flexible enough to sell out early if you have to, but the end of summer will almost always see the highs on the big cattle.

Once you get some cattle ready to sell, don't be as scared of buying the highs in the market. Selling the highs and buying the lows all the time would be great, but it isn't always as easy as it sounds. But as long as you always have some cattle ready to sell on the same market that you buy, you'll be okay in the long run.
 
JRD, find out if there is a grazing association in your state or area. They might have a mentoring program that could help you through the process and get you going in the right direction.
 
Texan and Per Thanks for the great input!!

To try and answer some things brought up..

the owner and the manager have both offered to stay on board as consultants to help with any questions and show me the ropes as to how they have set up the ranch as very " low stress" on the cattle and the handlers.

There is a huge market not more than 15 min from the ranch and from the reports seems to be doing well. the local word is people come from quit a distance to buy and sell there so im taking that as positive news.

and Per, I am signed up , sent emails, called, etc. every oraganization and association i can get my hands on. most are helpful and very positive as to hear someone my age trying to pull off what im going for. they gave me a fact and say the number of young ranchers from the 80's to today has dropped over 80 %. kind of shocked really.

thanks again guys!! I appreciate ya'lls time with the questions

CJ
 
Here is one thing that is important to keep in mind. Sometimes its cheaper to spend more money. Sounds crazy I know, but I learned my lesson last year.

We spent alot of time and money reworking 600 acres last year, and did not have enough cattle to graze it all when it was done. Could not get anyone to pay me for it at the time b/c most people dont have the cattle themselves thanks to Hurricane Ike...so I was left with three options.

1. Pay to get subpar hay put up off it
2. mow it down myself
3. Allow my neighbor to graze it for free. (he would not pay to graze it b/c he was fine himself

Ended up doing a combination of 2 and 3. Mowed some parts and allowed my neighbor to use some parts.

Even if you pay a little more than you want for some cattle, you have to figure in costs of upkeep if you dont have the cattle to keep it mowed.

If the weeds take over, it will cost more in the long run to get it back to where you need.
 
Here is just an old guys opinion. I always believed it best to make changes gradually. I wouldn't jump in with both feet until you have tested the water.

Without being on the spot it is hard to give any advise as operations everywhere are different. Looking at it from here, I would start trying to do as the past owner has done, until you get the feel of the place. Maybe you can see some mistakes he has made or some changes to do better.

I always think a person should look first at what he is trying to sell. Is it labor and expertise, grass and feed, maybe just yard space. I have a neighbor who backgrounds calves for someone else during the winter, he gets paid for yardage, labor and expertise, one way or another the owner of the cattle pays for the feed. It takes some expertise to process, wean, doctor, and care for the care for the calves that are brought in.


A man the runs cows and calves is selling labor and expetise as much as grass and feed. A stocker man may just be selling feed. A cow-calf man can sell his calf crop and still have the assets in his cow herd. A stocker man may just pay off the bank take off his living and operating expense, then need to borrow again to buy back.

In our operation here, we ran cows and calves, we built up a herd, but really dident make much headway until we got enough land so we could run our calf crop over to sell as yearlings.
 
JRD, another interesting way to go about things that hasn't been mentioned here is leasing cows. If you find someone willing to rent / lease their cows it can be a win / win situation. It can save the owner from getting into a tax situation by selling, and you get to have cattle without incurring a large interest bearing debt and minimizies risk.

http://www.agriculture.gov.sk.ca/cow-calf_lease_agreements
 

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