Size limit on heifer bulls

[WyomingRancher]

I don't think the accuracy is there with composite bulls. Quite a few calves could be lightweight and come easy. Then some others might be real big and cause severe calving problems. Back in the 1980's, a couple neighbors used half Longhorn-half British cross bulls on heifers and had substantial difficulty. My free and unsolicited advice would be to stick with straight Angus bulls to use on your first-calf heifers.

Yeah, you never know if hybrid vigor is going to start in the uterus. However, I must say I've had nothing but calving ease with my composite bulls FWIW . I did select ones with optimal calving ease numbers.

 

[Denny]

To me before I'll spend money on crossbred bull's I'll just go pick some off my commercial cow's.To me the simmental breed is a total Joke.In the 80's they looked like big herefords with more white if you bred them to black bull's you ended up with some rat tails I've always wondered how many generation's of angus it takes to change a zebra's stripes.

I seen an add that had a Black Charlaios for sale get real.

Look at the pedigree's on the simmentals they read like a who's who in the angus breed.

 

[andybob]

For the warmer areas, the Tuli gives a consistantly smaller calf, also up quickly, as would be expected of a breed developed in African bushveld, due to their unique genetics they give a big heterosis boost.
With their high qualty, well marbled meat, a red Tuli bull is complimentary to Angus.
http://www.tuli.co.za/
Since 1970, I ran Tuli under exensive coditions in the southern Karo ecosystem in Rhodesia/Zimbabwe where there was no supervision of calving etc, I exported to Namibia and South Africa from 1978 onward, with embryos going to Austalia and Canada, I kept a small pedigree herd in NC when I lived in the USA, where their easy keeping attracted wide interest amongst local cattle breeders, and the staff from Duke university, who came to see how they coped with the heat.

 

[Silver]

IMHO, for what it's worth.... a bulls birth weight is not nearly as important as where that bulls birth weight compares to the birthweights of his herdmates. I would rather have a bull born at 95 lbs when the herd average was 105 lbs than a bull that was born at 76 lbs where the herd average was 72 lbs.
Don't take from either the high end or the low end and things tend to work out fine.

It's disappointing to hear people run down the simmental breed. I know people who have earned as good a living as can be made ranching with outstanding herds of simmental that could be the envy of anyone. It's a breed not unlike any other though.... there's as much difference within it as there is between it and the others.

 

[wdcook]

A few years ago I tried going the Balancer route (GelbX Angus) in order to get some crossbreeding into my herd. I found that when I bred Balancer bull to Bal. cow most calved w/o assisstance, but every year I had 2 or 3 giant calves-even lost one cow. I am 58 yrs old and it is straight angus the rest of the way out for me.

 

[Big Muddy rancher]

For the warmer areas, the Tuli gives a consistantly smaller calf, also up quickly, as would be expected of a breed developed in African bushveld, due to their unique genetics they give a big heterosis boost.
With their high qualty, well marbled meat, a red Tuli bull is complimentary to Angus.
http://www.tuli.co.za/
Since 1970, I ran Tuli under exensive coditions in the southern Karo ecosystem in Rhodesia/Zimbabwe where there was no supervision of calving etc, I exported to Namibia and South Africa from 1978 onward, with embryos going to Austalia and Canada, I kept a small pedigree herd in NC when I lived in the USA, where their easy keeping attracted wide interest amongst local cattle breeders, and the staff from Duke university, who came to see how they coped with the heat.

When I started my cow herd I used a Watusi X Longhorn bull that was solid red. He had a butt end like a Limosin. He calved easy, the were vigorous and athletic. I never touch one being born and I used him 3 years. All calves were solid Black or red.

 

[Big Swede]

I have been using proven light birth weight Angus sires to AI my heifers for years and rarely see one born. Checking heifers every 4 hours but still if you see a water bag and go back in an hour to see how she is doing the calf is usually up sucking. With that being said I am very hesitant to change my breeding plan because like they say "if it aint broke don't fix it." But it seems like I can't help but think I could be doing something better so I am constantly thinking about tinkering with something. I guess I have a problem, always thinking. :?

 

[WyomingRancher]

I have been using proven light birth weight Angus sires to AI my heifers for years and rarely see one born. Checking heifers every 4 hours but still if you see a water bag and go back in an hour to see how she is doing the calf is usually up sucking. With that being said I am very hesitant to change my breeding plan because like they say "if it aint broke don't fix it." But it seems like I can't help but think I could be doing something better so I am constantly thinking about tinkering with something. I guess I have a problem, always thinking. :?

I agree, if you've got something which works, it's hard to justify changing. It's hard to pass up a little hybrid vigor though :wink: . From growth rates, to health, to fertility, to longevity, it just can't be beat IMO .

 

[Big Muddy rancher]

I have been using proven light birth weight Angus sires to AI my heifers for years and rarely see one born. Checking heifers every 4 hours but still if you see a water bag and go back in an hour to see how she is doing the calf is usually up sucking. With that being said I am very hesitant to change my breeding plan because like they say "if it aint broke don't fix it." But it seems like I can't help but think I could be doing something better so I am constantly thinking about tinkering with something. I guess I have a problem, always thinking. :?

Like I always say "You know what thought did" :wink:

 

[WyomingRancher]

I found you a bull :lol: , who needs a composite when you can step right up to a gelbvieh purebred :lol: . Got this catalog in the mail today, I don't know these people, but it looks like they have nice bulls, and they are fairly close to you. Lot 13 has very similar breeding to my calving ease Balancers. Just think, you could buy him, collect him, and use him for a clean-up bull . I know if these were PAP tested bulls, I'd be bidding.

http://www.beastromranch.com/BeastromsCatalog09.pdf

 

[Big Muddy rancher]

I found you a bull :lol: , who needs a composite when you can step right up to a gelbvieh purebred :lol: . Got this catalog in the mail today, I don't know these people, but it looks like they have nice bulls, and they are fairly close to you. Lot 13 has very similar breeding to my calving ease Balancers. Just think, you could buy him, collect him, and use him for a clean-up bull . I know if these were PAP tested bulls, I'd be bidding.

http://www.beastromranch.com/BeastromsCatalog09.pdf

I like that bull but I could find his sire in the reference bulls.