We were to get cattle next week that we bought from Superior earlier. They were heifers and were supposed to weigh 830# at this time. The rep called and they only weigh 618#. They only gained 3/4# since December. They were fed distillers,hay,silage. Flags are flying that why such a small gain. Is this a load we should back out of. Opinions needed. Thanks.
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peg4x4
Well-known member
I don't know from nothing,and I'd back out of this deal with tires smokein'.. Something is wrong!!
Turkey Track Bar
Well-known member
feeder wrote:
feeder:
My gut says I'd back out....here's why,
1. Corn prices are going up. That extra 200 pounds of gain will cost you more, that you likely counted on, in your breakeven analysis. Did you buy them cheap enough to offset this increase in feed costs? Could it be your corn is worth more by selling it, than feeding it? I don't know the answer to that question, but it's something I'd be thinking about.
2. Second, unless you can come up with sound reasons gains on this set of cattle were so poor, you might be setting yourself up for poor gainers when they get to your place.
Some reasons for their poor gain might include: sickness, breed and/or body type; poor lot conditions; poor ration/feed management, including a poorly balanced ration; and water quality issues. Of these the last three (the ration, water, and pen issues) are ones that you might be able to overcome, while the first two will dog the cattle forever.
3. Do you have a relationship with the seller of the cattle? If so, have you gotten good cattle from them before? If not, well....
Is there a penalty for backing out, if the cattle don't meet the contract specs?
Hope this helps,
Cheers---
TTB :wink:
We were to get cattle next week that we bought from Superior earlier. They were heifers and were supposed to weigh 830# at this time. The rep called and they only weigh 618#. They only gained 3/4# since December. They were fed distillers,hay,silage. Flags are flying that why such a small gain. Is this a load we should back out of. Opinions needed. Thanks.
feeder:
My gut says I'd back out....here's why,
1. Corn prices are going up. That extra 200 pounds of gain will cost you more, that you likely counted on, in your breakeven analysis. Did you buy them cheap enough to offset this increase in feed costs? Could it be your corn is worth more by selling it, than feeding it? I don't know the answer to that question, but it's something I'd be thinking about.
2. Second, unless you can come up with sound reasons gains on this set of cattle were so poor, you might be setting yourself up for poor gainers when they get to your place.
Some reasons for their poor gain might include: sickness, breed and/or body type; poor lot conditions; poor ration/feed management, including a poorly balanced ration; and water quality issues. Of these the last three (the ration, water, and pen issues) are ones that you might be able to overcome, while the first two will dog the cattle forever.
3. Do you have a relationship with the seller of the cattle? If so, have you gotten good cattle from them before? If not, well....
Is there a penalty for backing out, if the cattle don't meet the contract specs?
Hope this helps,
Cheers---
TTB :wink:
Feeder I don't know enough to offer advice but the gain does sound very low.
Can you call the cattleman that produced the calves and findout what is going on.
And please keep us informed. I am sure we could all learn alot form this.
And most of all, I wish you the very best.
Can you call the cattleman that produced the calves and findout what is going on.
And please keep us informed. I am sure we could all learn alot form this.
And most of all, I wish you the very best.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Yep- depends a lot on why they didn't gain- tough winter conditions, whatever-- and what you paid per pound for them...I'm sure you probably paid less per lb for the heaviweight you bid on than for the what the light weight your getting- was/is selling for...
Altho right now there isn't a big gap in heifers - around here those 618's would be worth about $110-- where those 830's would be worth about $95-97- the way the local markets have been running......Not so much difference per lb., but about $125 difference per head...
Looks to me like the one that really stands to lose bigtime ($100+ head) is the seller who sold his lightweight calves at a much heavier weight (lower) price than they will actually be....
Altho right now there isn't a big gap in heifers - around here those 618's would be worth about $110-- where those 830's would be worth about $95-97- the way the local markets have been running......Not so much difference per lb., but about $125 difference per head...
Looks to me like the one that really stands to lose bigtime ($100+ head) is the seller who sold his lightweight calves at a much heavier weight (lower) price than they will actually be....
IL Rancher
Well-known member
Would be nice if you could see them... I mean, I ahve seen some cattle just feed wrong over a winter not gain like they should but over that time they put on frame but where just green as all get up.. Once things got straightned out they just gained like no business for a while, or so it seemed, and than flattened off.. I don't know, I don't have a lot of experience with situations like this, keep us posted.
On an aside, this is what makes me nervous about selling through superior. I am terrible at predicting what my critters will weigh so I am always worried I am going to under weigh them or over do it and than I am going to be sol.. Still thinking about trying it this year as I am already getting tired of my feed bills from the yard where we retained some steers.. Nice to see how much they are eating, I just hope they are gaining well too...
On an aside, this is what makes me nervous about selling through superior. I am terrible at predicting what my critters will weigh so I am always worried I am going to under weigh them or over do it and than I am going to be sol.. Still thinking about trying it this year as I am already getting tired of my feed bills from the yard where we retained some steers.. Nice to see how much they are eating, I just hope they are gaining well too...
What I've found out is: the nutritionalist says he can't figure why they didn't gain, the rep say they look ok, my gut says"run as fast as you can". I believe we will not be penalized for backing out with that big of a weight difference. Mr. Feeder has someone that might be interested in taking the chance with the cattle, a day will tell. I thank you all for the quick response in your help. I'll be off the net for awhile due to trying again to get planting. I'll let you know what more happens.
Turkey Track Bar
Well-known member
bjb-iowa said:I WOULD WONDER IF I WAS GETTING THE SAME CATTLE I BOUGHT.
Good point!
Cheers---
TTB :wink:
Well, here is the scoop. They had QSA tags and were between 12-14 months old. They were eating 15-17 pounds of dry matter, they gained.67#/day.The seller really didn't want to sell them at the price we had paid for them at 830#. SO we shot him a price for him to pay us to back out of the deal and the seller accepted. So a check is in the mail to us. I feel for the seller but I think he will do better to resale them. The funny thing is, this is the first bunch of cattle we will have made money on in the last year and they didn't even get on the farm. This is the first time we ever had a problem (that I can remember) buying from Superior. I can't thank everyone enough for your input. I was afraid the better half would see the dollar difference and take the chance with the cattle. When he read all your comments he figured he'd heed your advise.
A
Anonymous
Guest
You probably did the safe, right thing...But if a guy had a little extra money to burn it would be interesting to see what they would do throwing them out on some of this good old prairie shortgrass tho for the summer...
But any time you can make money on a cow deal- your ahead of the game....
But any time you can make money on a cow deal- your ahead of the game....
OT, I feel we did the right thing for us but I feel for the seller. If it would have been only one load a person would dare take a chance but it was 240 head. Supposedly this is the first time this seller bought calves to grow them for resale. If I was him, I'd check with my feed consultant and compare with others if my ration was balanced.
sic 'em reds
Well-known member
Nothing against Superior, but they need to make sure the rep selling the cattle is being honest.
We bought 45 head of cows off there last fall that were supposed to be bred for 90 days. Started the end of January, had some calving the end of April. Okay, calved within the window. Preg checked 15 of them this morning, 4 open, the rest were June/July calvers according to the vet. We'll ship them tomorrow and the owner is going to make up the difference.
The worst thing is that we heard from one of the Western Video reps that the rep we bought the cows through knew there was this late bunch in the group, but still included them to fill the load. Some cattle buyers are known to be dishonest, this just proves it to me.
We bought 45 head of cows off there last fall that were supposed to be bred for 90 days. Started the end of January, had some calving the end of April. Okay, calved within the window. Preg checked 15 of them this morning, 4 open, the rest were June/July calvers according to the vet. We'll ship them tomorrow and the owner is going to make up the difference.
The worst thing is that we heard from one of the Western Video reps that the rep we bought the cows through knew there was this late bunch in the group, but still included them to fill the load. Some cattle buyers are known to be dishonest, this just proves it to me.
Northern Rancher
Well-known member
I haven't met a cattle buyrer yet who didn't proclaim his honesty and integrity amongst the other thieves in their profession. I'd take the slagging of Superior by a Western Video rep with maybe just a grain of salt. The rep can only pass on the information the seller gives him-glad your deal worked out for you Feeder for sure.
Big Muddy rancher
Well-known member
Well Hold on but i kinda agree with OT.
you bought those cattle at 8 weigth price per pound and 6 weight would have been more per pound. You probably could have turned those cattle at a sale yard on they way home and made money if you couldn't figutre a break even that would have worked.
you bought those cattle at 8 weigth price per pound and 6 weight would have been more per pound. You probably could have turned those cattle at a sale yard on they way home and made money if you couldn't figutre a break even that would have worked.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Big Muddy rancher said:Well Hold on but i kinda agree with OT.
you bought those cattle at 8 weigth price per pound and 6 weight would have been more per pound. You probably could have turned those cattle at a sale yard on they way home and made money if you couldn't figutre a break even that would have worked.
I know a lot of buyers that wouldn't be as nice as feeder and would have been jumping all over it.....Good they could work it all out tho....
murph
Well-known member
Sounds like the rep was working for both sides and did the right thing before the shipment instead of after. If you didnt have grass to turn those hfrs. out you problably did the right thing. What happened to the 40 dollar downpayment? BTW not all cattle buyers are crooks.
Northern Rancher
Well-known member
I know Murph but I find it funny when one is telling me about how crooked his competition is lol.
