What brand of mineral do you feed?

[eatbeef]

What brand of mineral do you feed and what is the make up of it as in Calcium-Phosphorus-Salt and any other speacial attributes to it. Just doing some thinking, pricing, and comparing.

I feed:
April 1 to June 30
Vitaferm Breeder Booster+MAG+IGR

Calcium (Ca) 8.0% Min. - 9.0% Max.
Phosphorus 6.0% Min.
Salt (NaCl) 9.2% Min. - 10.2% Max.
Magnesium (Mg) 10.0% Min.
Potassium (K)1.0% Min.
Cobalt (Co)40 ppm Min.
Copper (Cu)2,500 ppm Min.
Iodine (I)120 ppm Min.
Manganese (Mn)3,000 ppm Min.
Selenium (Se)27 ppm Min.
Zinc (Zn)5,000 ppm Min.
Vitamin A 300,000 IU/lb. Min.
Vitamin D-3 30,000 IU/lb. Min.
Vitamin E 400 IU/lb. Min.
Vitamin B-12 0.013 mg/lb. or 13.0 mcg/lb. Min.
Riboflavin 5.5 mg/lb. Min.
d-Pantothenic Acid 8.5 mg/lb. Min.
Thiamine 1.0 mg/lb. Min.
Niacin 50.0 mg/lb. Min.
Choline 500.0 mg/lb. Min

July 1 to March 31
Vitaferm Cattlemans Blend(with IGR from July 1 to killing freeze)

Calcium (Ca) ..................... 11.0% Min . 13.0% Max.
Phosphorus (P) ..................................... 5.0% Min.
Salt (NaCI) ........................ 19.5% Min . 23.0% Max.
Magnesium (Mg) .................................... 2.0% Min.
Potassium (K) ........................................ 2.0% Min.
Cobalt (Co) ........................................ 40 ppm Min.
Copper (Cu) ................................. 1,500 ppm Min.
Iodine(I) .......................................... 120 ppm Min.
Manganese (Mn) ........................... 3,000 ppm Min.
Selenium (Se) .................................... 27 ppm Min.
Zinc (Zn) ...................................... 3,700 ppm Min.
Vitamin A ................................ 300,000 lU/lb. Min.
Vitamin D-3 .............................. 30,000 lU/lb. Min.
Vitamin E ....................................... 200 lU/lb. Min.

 

[jodywy]

a custom one ,we bled cows and tested hay. Then before and during calving we have BioMos added.

 

[jodywy]

After testing hay and forage, then bleeding cows and comparing here is the custom mineral mix the lab and feed mill came up with.
Calcium… (min)…13 %...( max)…16.0%
Phosphorus (min)…………………..7.0%
Salt………. (min) …17.5 %...( max).21.0%
Magnesium (min)…………………….2.0%
Potassium (min)………………………0.3%
Zinc (min)………………………5,500 ppm
Manganese (min)……………….3,000 ppm
Copper (min) …………………...3,500 ppm
Selenium (min)…………………….40 ppm
Vitamin A (min)……………300,000 IU/lb
Ingredients:
Monocalcium Phosphate, Dicalcium Phosphate , Calcium Carbonate, Salt, Corn Distillers Dried Grains with solubles, Magnesium Oxide, Mineral Oil, Zinc Sulfate, Processed Grain Byproducts, Copper Sulfate, Manganese sulfate, Copper Proieinate , Yeast Culture, Sodium Selenite, Zinc Proteinate , Iron Oxide, Potassium Chloride, Red coloring, Vitamin E supplement , Vitamin A supplement,, Artificial Flavoring, Calcium Iodine, Vitamin D supplement, Ethylene Diainine Diaydnodide , Cobalt Sulfate
Caution: Product contains 18.2mg of Selenium per lb do not exceed 2.75 oz per head per day .

 

[LazyWP]

Why do people add salt into their mineral? When a good mineral program will cost you upwards to $1100/ton, and salt in this area is $150/ton, it just doesn't make any sense to me.

 

[Buyer]

Mineral who needs to feed mineral?

 

[PATB]

Those that have custom mineral mixes have you had your water sources tested? The minerals in water can change the mineral formulation needed.

 

[BRG]

We have a custom mineral as well. We hired a nutritionist and he comes out and tests the pasture waters and grasses, plus the well waters, hay, and feeds that go into the feedlot. He figures out what is needed and what isn't and then make an order. We REALLY like it!

 

[jodywy]

Why do people add salt into their mineral? When a good mineral program will cost you upwards to $1100/ton, and salt in this area is $150/ton, it just doesn't make any sense to me.

need salt either to get them to eat it or limit it

 

[BRG]

Why do people add salt into their mineral? When a good mineral program will cost you upwards to $1100/ton, and salt in this area is $150/ton, it just doesn't make any sense to me.

need salt either to get them to eat it or limit it

We have found that with our custom mineral they put in a small amount, just enough so they eat it. But we do not mix as it costs way to much if they over eat. Most minerals you purchase at a store are like 20% salt already. Salt is cheap, mineral isn't, so we stopped adding the salt.

 

[LazyWP]

Why do people add salt into their mineral? When a good mineral program will cost you upwards to $1100/ton, and salt in this area is $150/ton, it just doesn't make any sense to me.

need salt either to get them to eat it or limit it

I guess that was my point. I can add, or lessen the amount of salt myself, and it is a darn sight cheaper for me to do it, then the manufacturer.

When I had my own place, I had everything tested. Grass, hay, water, and we even did soil tests, then custom blended a mineral program to meat the cattle needs. At that time, I was selling salt. The mineral, at that time was costing right at $1000/ton, and I was selling salt for $55/ton. It doesn't take much work to get the cows to eat the correct amount.

 

[jodywy]

Why do people add salt into their mineral? When a good mineral program will cost you upwards to $1100/ton, and salt in this area is $150/ton, it just doesn't make any sense to me.

need salt either to get them to eat it or limit it

I guess that was my point. I can add, or lessen the amount of salt myself, and it is a darn sight cheaper for me to do it, then the manufacturer.

When I had my own place, I had everything tested. Grass, hay, water, and we even did soil tests, then custom blended a mineral program to meat the cattle needs. At that time, I was selling salt. The mineral, at that time was costing right at $1000/ton, and I was selling salt for $55/ton. It doesn't take much work to get the cows to eat the correct amount.

we were bleeding cow for Bangs because of the ELK here , so we also took every 10 cows blood to test along with hay and forage .

 

[nortexsook]

We have a custom mineral as well. We hired a nutritionist and he comes out and tests the pasture waters and grasses, plus the well waters, hay, and feeds that go into the feedlot. He figures out what is needed and what isn't and then make an order. We REALLY like it!

How much does this professional charge for these services?

Is it a once a year test?

 

[BRG]

We have a custom mineral as well. We hired a nutritionist and he comes out and tests the pasture waters and grasses, plus the well waters, hay, and feeds that go into the feedlot. He figures out what is needed and what isn't and then make an order. We REALLY like it!

How much does this professional charge for these services?

Is it a once a year test?

We hired him year round for our entire operation. He also makes our rations, for each pen in the feedlot, comes out regularly to see if rations are working, takes all feed samples, etc. So we pay him a little different than what someone who would charge just for the mineral tests. Plus he is independent and doesn't sell feed, so he locates us the best deal as well instead of promoting his product.

We feel this was the best investment we have made in quite a while, calves were heavier last fall, cows are in better condition, calves hair looked awesome, breeding % was best in years, and the bulls did better in the lot than ever before on a cooler ration. Things need to be balanced correct to make it all work.

 

[Jake]

BRG do you think your investment would payoff in a commercial operation?

 

[Hayguy]

My, My a whole page and a bit on mineral and no comment's from FASTER HORSES, hope she's allright :lol:

 

[BRG]

BRG do you think your investment would payoff in a commercial operation?

If you are having specific issues that need corrected, I would think so. He has commercial ranchers who have hired him as well.

 

[Faster horses]

My, My a whole page and a bit on mineral and no comment's from FASTER HORSES, hope she's allright :lol:

:lol: :lol: :lol: I'm just fine. This subject comes up every year about this time.

We work with many livestock producers and none of them hire a nutritionist,
I can understand why some people might think they need one and that's fine.
For our customers we find it is best to 'keep it simple.' We do have an
excellent mineral to use for bulls that helps scrotal development, etc.
Our country-wide area sales managers take grass,water and hay samples
all the time at no cost to the producer.

My area sales manager has a huge complilation of grass samples
from our area, and with ONE exception the grass is close to the same
everywhere. That one ranch uses a custom mineral from Vigortone, made
especially for them based on grass and water samples we took. They've
used that formula for over 18 years now and it works very well.

We have basically two products that we mainly sell in our area and you
can get them as plain mineral or with IGR, CTC, Safeguard,
Bovatech, Rumensin, Bio-Moss, Higher magnesium; DG when feeding corn gluten, etc. We also have feedlot and dairy mineral.
Sheep, goat and horse mineral too.
We have at our disposal over 100 different mineral products that covers just about everything.
Our bull developer is 3662SR, meaning it contains rumensin and a really super mineral package.
It can be used for replacement heifers as well.

As for the salt, we come up against that all the time. We have a product that
has very little salt, but we sell more of the formula with more salt. Did it
ever occur to anyone that companies like ours can purchase salt cheaper than
an independent person can? Also, we encourage our producers to NOT mix
salt in the mineral by hand. When that happens, you have just ruined the mixture
that the plant, with all it's sophisticated machinery mixes to a high standard.
You just can't mix
it up good enough by hand--cattle might not get their mineral requirement for
the day and yet get their salt requirement for the week when it is mixed by
hand. With our low-salt mineral, we encourage the rancher to buy loose salt
and put it out in a seperate feeder. One thing with buying mineral with salt already mixed in, the cattle eat the mineral more consistently.

Make sure your mineral does not contain grain by-products. That is way more
of a concern than the salt content. Do you want to pay mineral price for grain?

As for the % formula, that doesn't mean a whole lot, what is really important is
the INGREDIENTS that make up the mineral. Not all ingredients are created equal. For instance, some companies use CTC from China because it is cheaper.
We do not, we use CTC from the USA. I think it was Jody that first posted the
ingredients in the mineral he uses and that is what is most important.

Phos is the most expensive ingredient in mineral and we are being shown all time
that cattle do not need the amount of phos that was thought earlier. Phos is
bitter and if the cows don't eat the mineral because of it being bitter, they
aren't getting what they need to balance their system. In other words,
cattle eat grams, not percents. Does that make any sense?

Anyway, I hope this helps.
To answer the question posted:" who feeds mineral";
I can tell you without a doubt that the producers who have not fed mineral and start feeding it see a real difference in 1.)calf weaning weights 2.)herd health and 3.)conception rates.
A quality mineral program pays for itself many times over.

I have made it a mission to educate ranchers about mineral because there is
so much misinformation out there. Anyone can do a 'search' and read my past
posts. We were in real trouble with sick cattle from 1985-1993 and it was
nothing more than a copper deficiency that no one seemed to know about
at that time. Vigortone mineral was our answer. When you go from doctoring
99% of your calves (and many times more than once) to doctoring ZERO all year long, it makes a believer out of you.

Well, those of you who have read this far, I appreciate your interest. I am here to
help anyone who has questions about mineral. We started learning about it
in 1994; and I would hate to go back to the days before we knew about what
mineral can do for you and your cows. You can PM me with questions or ask
them on the forum. My reward is helping people fix problems with their cattle.

Remember, well cattle are normal, sick cattle aren't.

 

[flyingS]

I really don't care what a manufactorer pays for salt, if I pay 1200/ton for mineral I am still paying 1200/ton for the salt put in that mineral even if they only pay 50/ton. I truly believe that if she needs it she will consume it. I have fed several brands of mineral and different formulas within a brand as well as worked where they didn't ever feed mineral. Some had salt some did not. The only thing that I found to be cosistent was if you feed salt and mineral in 2 seperate bunks your cows will tell which they need, If you mix or cut mineral with salt it is costing you a lot of money to feed salt. I don't buy the taste line, I have seen cows licking stuff that is not in there diet when they are lacking something. As far as herd health, mineral might help at times of the year. Although nothing can replace good herd and pasture management. I mean clostral immunity and fresh pasture. I have documented numbers to back that up and can honestly say climate will not change the results. While seeing the difference in performance the mineral package stayed consistent.
No offense FH, I never take advice from someone that is selling a product. I do my research and get advice from someone who has nothing to gain from my ignorance. Then I go out and bid product. I used to work with a man that was paid salary by the company and was willing to show me documentation to prove it. He gave me good advice and his product was always reasonably priced, yes I would still bid it and he knew it. He never tried to pull the wool over my eyes and he kept my business,

 

[LazyWP]

I will say BULL S*** to your company buying salt cheaper. I have brokered enough salt to know the prices. The only reason any mineral company would add any salt, is because its cheap, and the average cowman has been led to believe that salt must be in their mineral. A generic, one size fits all program is a sales persons dream, and for the most part does little for the individual cowman.
You can get most of your samples tested through your extension office, so it isn't all that expensive, nor hard to do.
I am not slamming Vigortone, nor any other mineral company, but if you guys are serious about trying to improve your efficiency, breed up, and overall herd health, do your research. Vigortone HAS done the research, and meets your generic needs, but I DO BELIEVE a person can go way beyond generic, basic needs.

 

[Big Muddy rancher]

I will say BULL S*** to your company buying salt cheaper. I have brokered enough salt to know the prices. The only reason any mineral company would add any salt, is because its cheap, and the average cowman has been led to believe that salt must be in their mineral. A generic, one size fits all program is a sales persons dream, and for the most part does little for the individual cowman.
You can get most of your samples tested through your extension office, so it isn't all that expensive, nor hard to do.
I am not slamming Vigortone, nor any other mineral company, but if you guys are serious about trying to improve your efficiency, breed up, and overall herd health, do your research. Vigortone HAS done the research, and meets your generic needs, but I DO BELIEVE a person can go way beyond generic, basic needs.

So where is the mineral you feed manufactured?