Tex said:
Whitewing said:
Nice of you to argue a point that wasn't made, but we'll skip that for now.
Here's my point about the Patriot Act:
Since you and Shamu appear to frequent similar websites; websites dedicated to revealing the "truth" about our government and its direct involvement in 9-11 and the murder of thousands of American citizens, I would assume that you guys would be the first to have been targeted by an act that would allow gvt agents to kick down your doors and beat the crap out of you without a warrant.
Have you spoken LB to anyone on any of those sites who've had a bad experience (rights taken away via the Patriot Act)?
Just wondering.
Whitewing, I really don't think this is a good argument. Our most recent and outrageous abuse of this argument was with Hitler and the Jews. If it didn't affect a non Jew, you were encouraged to not worry about it.
I think when we allow acts that are not overseen by another branch of government, we allow ourselves to be open to government abuse with no way of determining whether the "Jews" of the day are being taken in a train to a rendering facility.
We protect other people's rights not because we like other people, but because in protecting those rights, we protect our own.
Tex
Well Tex, I simply asked Lightninboy if he could site any examples of the Patriot Act infringing on his rights or the rights of anyone he knew. So far, it hasn't affected him from what he's said. I do understand though the point you're trying to make.
We've discussed here the possible illegal mining of telephone information and perhaps other potential abuses, but those seem a far cry from the kicking down of the doors and stomping the crap out of people that Shamu has mentioned.
To a degree, this topic reminds me of the argument my now-dead brother (an attorney) often had with my parents about random road blocks looking for drunk drivers, illegal weapons, drugs etc. He was against them, my parents didn't care because they knew they weren't going to be driving drunk, carry illegal weapons, or doing drugs.
Also, talking about mining information. I recall walking into an AutoZone Auto Parts store one day in Mississippi and asking about replacing an alternator on a pickup. The guy asked me my home phone number (in Louisiana) and with that alone proceeded to rattle off data about me that left me with my mouth hanging open.
My point, we're getting mined every single day by far more than our gubmint, and probably with far greater potential negative consequences.