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2nd Annual Coyote Calling Contest

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You sound like a reasonable man Jinglebob........What would you think if someone said " Walmart is bad news.....lets have us a protest and not buy nothin from walmart" then after the movement gets underway come to find out the leader is buying tires from walmart because they are cheaper....but nothing but tires, because the clothing comes from sweatshops and such but its ok for tires. I feel its plain and simple and its called hyprocricy. thats my opinion. does no one have that same feelings about the issue or am i just out in left field somewhere?
 
Big Muddy rancher said:
Liberty Belle said:
If you allow hunting how is to be policed?
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What's to be policed about shooting coyotes? We'll take care of trespassers and I can't think of anything else that needs to be handled, can you?
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I thought the idea of the lockout was NO HUNTERS=NO GAME WARDENS. Now you want to let hunter back in but not the game wardens. Looks like a little having the cake and eating it to.
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I agree with you southdakota hunter . this is what i wroye to get this started and I have been able to sit back and see how you guys feel cause it really is a SD issue as i have not heard of this problem any where else.
 
Man o man.........isnt it amaizing how people get to name calling when i have only stated facts. You can call me all the names you want to, it just shows how inteligent you are.) You are telling me this calling contest is just calling.....and when they get called in your not gonna shoot em which would be hunting? I know of duck calling contests that are done at cabellas or ace hardware or the legion or somewhere. Is that what type of a calling contest this is? Again, i understand it is your land but how the heck can you say "lockout....no hunting" but hunt coyotes???

Pests? Yes i would agree....some feel deer and antelope are pests. You have to have a hunting license to hunt prairie dogs, coyotes, deer, whatever. Hunting is hunting and no one has yet explaind to me why one is ok and the other is not. Quit name calling and explain. I do know something for a fact, anytime name calling starts, you loose respect from whoever. I can respect your standing your ground and not allowing hunting but when you decide to allow one and not the other, people start questioning your thinking. Other than hypocrit, (maybe misspelled) i have not slung any mud and i really dont feel i deserve to be called names. Still waiting for a logical explaination!
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If you are waiting for me to apologize for calling you a thick skulled jerk with no respect for landowners, I hope you're not holding your breath. Do you deserve those names? I'll leave that to the readers to decide and if I've "lost" your respect, oh well.

While I'm on my soapbox, I'll point out that several on this board have tried to explain these issues to you with absolutely no success, which only illustrates the validity of my remark about your thick skull. What is your reading comprehension level anyway? My first-grade grandson understands these issues very well, as does jake's little girl in the same grade.

Go back and read the numerous posts by jake, Jinglebob, hometowngurl, theshootist, Oldtimer, foreman, TXTibbs, Faster Horses, me and even Hay Maker. Read them slowly out loud to yourself and maybe the gist of what we have already tried to explain to you will soak in, although I have my doubts. Your mind is like concrete – all mixed up and permanently set.

By the way, what makes you think we need to justify anything to you? What we do with and on our land is no more your business than me telling you what color to paint your garage is my business. You take care of your land and we'll take care of ours.
I feel its plain and simple and its called hyprocricy. thats my opinion. does no one have that same feelings about the issue or am i just out in left field somewhere?
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Yes. You are. :twisted:
I agree with you southdakota hunter . this is what i wroye to get this started and I have been able to sit back and see how you guys feel cause it really is a SD issue as i have not heard of this problem any where else.
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Big Muddy has got it partly right - this is a SD issue that does not concern anyone except those who own private property and are trying to protect the rights to that property.
 
ouch....here we go again...insults. And you know what, it really should matter to you what i think becaus i am a registered voter like most hunters in our great state which is why it failed in the past. YOU need us hunters as much as we need you landowners to continue supporting the critters by giving them a place to live and eat. Hunters contacted their reps like never before. If you want this issue to be resolved through the legislature you need us hunters to support it and if you contionue calliing us names we wont support you at all, even IF we hunters begin to agree with you. Us hunters far outnumber the lockout, THAT is why you need us. Being a hypocrit does not help your situation. Many hunters feel you dont want us on your land because of this lockout and many understand but then you allow coyote hunting and they feel like they are being used.
 
Southdakotahunter said:
ouch....here we go again...insults. And you know what, it really should matter to you what i think becaus i am a registered voter like most hunters in our great state which is why it failed in the past. YOU need us hunters as much as we need you landowners to continue supporting the critters by giving them a place to live and eat. Hunters contacted their reps like never before. If you want this issue to be resolved through the legislature you need us hunters to support it and if you contionue calliing us names we wont support you at all, even IF we hunters begin to agree with you. Us hunters far outnumber the lockout, THAT is why you need us. Being a hypocrit does not help your situation. Many hunters feel you dont want us on your land because of this lockout and many understand but then you allow coyote hunting and they feel like they are being used.
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I will add my thoughts and reply to your post at the top and also the above one.

Very few on here would call me reasonable! :shock: :lol:

Your asking about Walmart is comparing apples to oranges.

You say we need you hunter more than you need us? :???: Funny, looks like if every landowner in the state did not allow hunting, then there would be few places to hunt in this state. As LB has pointed out, we don't need hunter.

I'm not saying that some of us don't have friends who come to hunt and that we ourselves don't enjoy hunting, but again this is not a hunting issue, this is a private property issue.

I was locked out this year and it wouldn't have mattered whether someone affered me a million bucks to hunt, they wouldn't have been allowed to hunt.

I asked somewhere on here whether mice were big game animals. Most would say no, they are pests. If the State owns all livestock, why don't you need a lisence to hunt mice? To some, deer are pests and antalope are pests. Most of us don't feel that way.

If you had read the bill that was before the legislature, you would see that there was no reason that a Conservastion officer could not go anywhere they wanted, AS LONG AS THERE WAS REASONABLE SUSPISION!

They don't want the hassle of having to prove that they were suspecting something of gong on.

Why should the GF&P have more power than any other law official?

As for the name calling, if the shoe fits, wear it. I never get to excdited is someone calls me an SOB if I have any doubts as to whether I am an SOB. :) And there have been a lot of name calling going on on both sides of this issue.

Many of us feel that if we don't stop "big brother" sometime on these issues, we are all sunk.

I guess I feel it is my property,I pay the taxes and the bills, and I don't want anyone telling what to do or not do on it, unless it is causing harm to someone else. And I do believe we need game laws and people to RESONABLY enforce them.

When the Governor and Secratary Cooper alluded that anyone with a larger amount of land was breaking game laws, it kind'a rankled. Sure wish they would drive into my yard and we could discuss it! :wink:

As far as someone locking out hunter, maybe it would have been better stated to say they were locking out hunters who hunt only big game, cuz thats where the bucks are! Get it? :lol: Man I just kill myself! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Oh, and if you want a place to hunt next year, don't call! :lol:
 
Jinglebob, i do understand every aspect of your cause. I do understand all your feelings on the issue and i can see your point, i really can. I did not say you or any landowner needs hunters more than i need the landowner. I wouldnt say i need the landowner more either. what is did say is you guys need us as much as we need you and what i meant by that was that your cause needs us hunters to realize the situation. Until the hunters come to your side, this thing will never work because the hunter outnumbers the landowner and a vote is a vote. Get the hunters on the bandwagon and you have won. I think the saying is "you attract more bees with honey" and i think that is true. You cant compair mice with coyotes or deer or goats because the gfp dont. If i read the lockout website, one of the articals compaired picking nightcrawlers in the front yard with game hunting? thats like compairing mice with game. not the same. I hear you j-bob....i really do. There are a small amount of landowners out there, of which i am sure you or LB or many of the others are not a part of, that would take advantage of it by 1. Issuing their own licenses 2. Deciding limits on game 3. deciding when seasons start and such and thats why the law is the way the law is. In my area the gfp are decent people (most) who want to help the hunter and the landowner, just like they should and if you guys have a bad egg or 2 that needs to be addressed. I am sure its like cops, there are a few bad ones who think their s&*t dont stink. I think you were right, your movement should maybe have said "no big game" but then the hunters would think they are only wanted for pest control...its a damned if you do and a damned if you dont deal. I wont ask to hunt because i dont hunt that area of the state, Its really too far out since i have relatives who have land closer (west river) but others may ask and hopefully someday they will get permision or a polite "no" I really feel however, that if you are gonna lockout...lockout everything...deer, goats, prairie dogs, coyotes, coons, badgers, pheasants, grouse, dove, goose, duck, whatever the game and they are all game of some type, that way there are no questions of your goals. I can tell you this much for sure. If someone dont let me hunt that is fine , i go elsewhere but i sure wont help when it becomes a problem either.
 
one more thing....all laws, good or bad are made because of a very very small few that have broke them before, not because they are accusing everyone of that, its always one or 2 bad apples that spoil the entire bag.
 
I wasn't going to chime in, but some of SDhunter's statements about us landowners "needin hunters" pricked me the wrong way.

Gov't has too much power the way it is, and just like anything, if you give them an inch, you'll never get it back and they'll stretch it a mile.

I own land, I ranch (unfortunately not full-time, but working my way back into it), and I decided, like alot of good folks, East or West River, North or South, to send a strong message that GF&P has to treat my ownership of MY LAND with as much respect as I expect from anyone. They don't have more rights to my land than I do. I believe in lockout, with me doing the deciding.

Last I knew, I was the only one paying the payment on my cattle and on my land. Last I knew, I was the one writing the check for the taxes and insurance, the vet bills, and the feed bills. I was also the only one left holding the bag if things didn't work out for the year, or I lost money selling cattle, or I had to repair 1/4 mile fence because of the ice or snow drifts. I didn't see GF&P out there doing it for me and I didn't see any hunter out there doing it for me. Therefore, in my mind, I should be the only one who gets to decide WHEN and IF I let someone come onto my property, unless it falls under those narrow scope of exceptions already defined in the law.

This isn't about money, but it appears the excuse to keep arguing about "your" rights is grounded squarely on this age-old argument of last resort. If logic fails, go back to arguing the money issue. I find it hard to believe that you are comfortable allowing someone without permission onto your land unless they are in the process of preventing a crime that involves SERIOUS BODILY HARM, if you are truly a landowner SDhunter. This issue is about saying who can come and go off my property when I say they can.

This issue is akin to passing such a loose bill to allow police to walk into anyone's back yard in town without any probable cause because they saw some kid/person in the backyard that they didn't remember seeing there before or maybe just looked like they didn't belong and they wanted to ask them a question. Or, better yet, they come into your house without a search warrant, based on a tip from your neighbor that you may have stolen property.

Now, in the real world, as it is today, police need a search warrant to act on a tip like that and they can't just walk into your backyard without permission unless it's under a very limited and strigent set of exceptions, none of which I'll go into here, as you can look it up online if you wish.

Bottom line is that I own my property and no one has the right to tell me who I can and can't have on my property for the purposes stated in this thread -- "everyone's critters" or not. If I want to allow someone on my property to hunt coyotes, then I will. And if GF&P has a question about what they are doing there, they can come and talk to me about who's on my land. They don't have the right to just cross a fence and walk around because they wear a badge. That's not democracy, that dictatorship.

I am not native to East River SD, but I come from a good line of ranch folks, and as far as I can tell, we all think alike and there are values common to us all raised in that fashion. Any of you West River folks, East River folks, North and South folks, are welcome at my table as long as you hold land rights as dear as I do and respect my land owner rights.
 
From the looks of rural South Dakota I'm surprised you can't find a compromise for the sake of your local businessmen-I know how much money recreation brings into my community. I made this short so LB wouldn't use up all her cut and paste-I think I might have to go hang out at Doc Ismay's again and see if there's anybody left in South Dakota with a sense of humour.
 
Just a question-if a warden sees someone poaching inside your fenceline and he asks permission to go investigate and the landowner refuses access what happens then.
 
I think you guys misunderstood SDhunter. When he said you guys need hunters ,he meant you need their support to get this bill passed. he agrees with you but that NO HUNTING should Mean NO HUNTING..
Thats what I said when this was first posted. I didn't really disagree with the lockout just the selective lock out. Looks to me is that you guys just don't have the back bone to stand up for yourselves.
 
Northern Rancher said:
Just a question-if a warden sees someone poaching inside your fenceline and he asks permission to go investigate and the landowner refuses access what happens then.
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If a GM saw some one hunting, then they have every right to go and ask to see a lisence. He wouldn't need to ask permission and wouldn't anyway. He could stop and ask the landowner if he knew if he had hunters on him and the landowner could either4 say, yup there's hunters out there, or nope we ain't got any and then the GM would have a good reason to go.

We have no problem with a GM doing his duty as long as he has RESONABLE CAUSE. Just like any other law enforcement official.

As far as the mmice vs deer issue, maybe you better go see if the state owns ALL the wild life. If mice ain't wildlife, what are they?
 
Northern Rancher: From the looks of rural South Dakota I'm surprised you can't find a compromise for the sake of your local businessmen-I know how much money recreation brings into my community. I made this short so LB wouldn't use up all her cut and paste-I think I might have to go hang out at Doc Ismay's again and see if there's anybody left in South Dakota with a sense of humour.
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What? Not use my cut and paste? Where's YOUR sense of humor?
As far as our local businessmen go – what do you think we are – chopped liver?
Northern Rancher: Just a question-if a warden sees someone poaching inside your fenceline and he asks permission to go investigate and the landowner refuses access what happens then.
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Okay – for starters, if a game warden or any other law enforcement officer sees someone poaching, that is what is known as "probable cause" and they don't need the landowner's permission to stop any criminal activity. They don't need that permission now and they wouldn't need it if either SB122 or HB 1258 had passed. Read the copy of the bill I posted.
BMR: I think you guys misunderstood SDhunter. When he said you guys need hunters ,he meant you need their support to get this bill passed. he agrees with you but that NO HUNTING should Mean NO HUNTING..
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We're not out anything if this bill never passes. The only folks who stand to lose anything by the lockout continuing are hunters who are left with only public land to hunt. Most of the deer and antelope are located on private land and that is not going to be available to hunters until the landowner's rights are protected. And I have neither the time nor the energy to understand SDhunter. He's on his own.
BMR: Thats what I said when this was first posted. I didn't really disagree with the lockout just the selective lock out.
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If you think we're going to let ourselves be overrun by predators and prairie dogs just because you think we shouldn't allow any shooting, you've got another think coming. A good manager will never allow either pest or predator to decimate his pastures or his livestock just to make a point to a bunch of folks who don't even have a dog in this fight.

Heck, you don't even live in the USA. What got you so worked up over our problems? Doesn't Canada have enough problems to keep you busy?
BMR: Looks to me is that you guys just don't have the back bone to stand up for yourselves.
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Try driving up to one of the locked out landowner's ranches and repeat that statement. You might find more backbone than you can handle.
 
So liberty if you get over run with deer in your stacks are you going to have a deer shooting contest. I never said you shouldn't control you own coyotes but if you don't want hunters why don't you lock them all out? As I understand it coyote hunters need a licence in SD so does that allow the Game warden acess when he see a hunter on your land.
I post my land for hunting on foot only that means coyotes as well.

Looks to me that you have confused shooting with hunting.

The back bone remark was a bit faceiuos but SDhunter was trying to understand and suppout you but you seem to have a mad on. I know I'm not from the US but I am a landowner. I also sit on the Wildlife advisory committee representing the Stockgrowers at the Sask Environment table where all the wildlife groups do some of their lobbing for more hunting quotas and privledges so I am interested in what is happening in South dakota. I still say NO Hunting means No Hunting. That is one of my pet peeves that hunting can still be allowed when those signs are posted.
 
So liberty if you get over run with deer in your stacks are you going to have a deer shooting contest.
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:)
I never said you shouldn't control you own coyotes but if you don't want hunters why don't you lock them all out?
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Lock out what? Coyotes?
As I understand it coyote hunters need a licence in SD so does that allow the Game warden acess when he see a hunter on your land.
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To shoot coyotes in South Dakota you only need a general hunting license, which almost everyone has. If the game warden tries to come on my land to check anyone for a general hunting license, he's gonna need a real good lawyer. Our sheriff won't stand for abuse of either the law or property rights by anyone, GF&P or hunters.

Looks to me that you have confused shooting with hunting.
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Looks to me like one of us is confused.

The back bone remark was a bit faceiuos but SDhunter was trying to understand and suppout you but you seem to have a mad on. I know I'm not from the US but I am a landowner. I also sit on the Wildlife advisory committee representing the Stockgrowers at the Sask Environment table where all the wildlife groups do some of their lobbing for more hunting quotas and privledges so I am interested in what is happening in South dakota. I still say NO Hunting means No Hunting. That is one of my pet peeves that hunting can still be allowed when those signs are posted.
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One of my pet peeves are people who stick their nose in our business and get that nose out of joint when we don't happen to care for all that free advice.

Where did you get the idea SDhunter was trying to "understand and support" us anyway?
 

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