Canadian Health Care Imploding

[Kato]

And yes they do die that is why Cancer survival rate is behind the U.S. even though they all get free medical!

And the U.S. has a higher infant mortality rate, so is that better? :???: :???: A person could cherry pick statistics all day, and still not come to a true conclusion.

Alberta seems to be one province where the grumbling about the health care system is the loudest. I wonder how much of this unhappiness is due to the huge explosion in population in Alberta over the past ten years, and the speed or lack of speed that the medical community has shown in keeping up with it? Yhe population growth in Calgary alone has been phenomenal, and would put a strain on any medical system, no matter how it is set up. In provinces where the growth in demand has been more stable, they seem to be keeping up better.

 

[Tam]

I am sure many get good health care in Canada! Someone has to be getting care or there would not be those waiting for care that are complaining.

I went to a Garth Brooks Concert once and hated it! My friend was there and he loved it. Maybe the difference was he got tickets Center front stage 5th row up and me and wife ended up in the nose bleed seats! I did not complain though because I got what I paid for!

Problem is in Canada everyone pays the same so why should some be happy with care and get service while others wait in pain or to die? And yes they do die that is why Cancer survival rate is behind the U.S. even though they all get free medical!

See again your wrong .No people do not all pay the same in Canada for medical care......Geeze I wish you would at least know what you tell others ....I do not get free medical...I do however get affordable medical......

You are right nonothing we don't all pay the same some pay alot more in taxes that others do but we all have access to the less than optimal care of the same One payer "tax funded" health care system. A system that is on the verge of imploding, but hey that is just my opinion. NO wait it was the Canadian Medical Association DOCTORS that says we are getting less than optimal care and the system is about to implode. Wasn't it. :wink:

 

[ranch hand]

Ot.... why do you want health reform so it is paid for my tax payers....I bet so you lovely wife can retire and not work to cover your butt on health insurance. You stated earlier that she works to keep the health insurance. Most ranchers carry their own insurance. Just wondering why you don't so she can retire :roll: :roll: .

 

[Anonymous]

Ot.... why do you want health reform so it is paid for my tax payers....I bet so you lovely wife can retire and not work to cover your butt on health insurance. You stated earlier that she works to keep the health insurance. Most ranchers carry their own insurance. Just wondering why you don't so she can retire :roll: :roll: .

Very simply- we both have pre existing conditions that came on when we hit our 50's- and cannot get any other insurance.....

And ranch hand-- I don't want the taxpayers to pay for my insurance- I just want it so the insurance companies are required to give coverage to ALL-- and can't drop people just because they get a costly illness/injury and skip out of their responsibility like is happening so often now.....

And actually around here-- many many ranchers wives work in town just so they can get or afford health insurance.....

 

[hypocritexposer]

Ot.... why do you want health reform so it is paid for my tax payers....I bet so you lovely wife can retire and not work to cover your butt on health insurance. You stated earlier that she works to keep the health insurance. Most ranchers carry their own insurance. Just wondering why you don't so she can retire :roll: :roll: .

Very simply- we both have pre existing conditions that came on when we hit our 50's- and cannot get any other insurance.....

And ranch hand-- I don't want the taxpayers to pay for my insurance- I just want it so the insurance companies are required to give coverage to ALL-- and can't drop people just because they get a costly illness/injury and skip out of their responsibility like is happening so often now.....

OT, why is a 1000 page bill required to do that? With the way the House bill is written, you're more likely to get end of life counselling, and some pain killers.

 

[ranch hand]

OT..then lets just fix that problem and not revamp the whole system. Why throw out the baby with the bath water? Lets take our system now and fix what is wrong instead of starting all over. Lets limit people who don't have health insurance on the number of kids they can have. Lets take the illegals off the health insurance. Lets take the welfare..medcaid people that don't work and make them pick up garbage or what ever they can do to pay back for the services they recieve. Why the whole systems needs reworked is beyond me. :???:

 

[Tam]

http://www.fraserinstitute.org/Commerce.Web/product_files/CanadasHealthCareSystemPoorValueforTaxDollars.pdf

Canada's health care system—poor value for your tax dollars
-------

Unfortunately, as the following data clearly shows, Canada's taxpayers are not receiving the same sort of value that their counterparts in other nations are when it comes to universally accessible health care insurance. To begin with, Canadians are funding the developed world's third most expensive universal access health insurance system.

---------

Given this level of expenditure, you might expect that Canadians receive world-class access to health care. But the evidence demonstrates that this is not so. Consider Canada's waiting lists. In 2007, waiting lists for access to health care in Canada reached a new all-time high of 18.3 weeks from general practitioner referral to treatment by a specialist. Despite substantial increases in both health spending and federal cash transfers to the provinces for health care over the last decade or so, this wait time is 54% longer than the overall median wait time of 11.9 weeks back in 1997 Canada's waiting lists are also, according to available evidence, among the longest in the developed world.

Access to medical technologies is also relatively poor in Canada.

While our taxes can and do pay for important and valuable services for all Canadians, it is critical that we assess whether or not we are receiving value for the dollars we are spending. In the case of health care, it is clear that Canadians are paying for a world-class health care system, but are not receiving one in return. Hopefully, this knowledge will encourage Canadians to think more carefully about the need for substantial reform of Canada's failing approach to health care policy.

Just some more of my opinions Oldtimer!!!!! :wink:

 

[Anonymous]

OT..then lets just fix that problem and not revamp the whole system. Why throw out the baby with the bath water? Lets take our system now and fix what is wrong instead of starting all over. Lets limit people who don't have health insurance on the number of kids they can have. Lets take the illegals off the health insurance. Lets take the welfare..medcaid people that don't work and make them pick up garbage or what ever they can do to pay back for the services they recieve. Why the whole systems needs reworked is beyond me. :???:

Will Hypo let you do that? Where in the Constitution allows telling folks how many kids they can have? (Sandhusker- ain't that Chinese socialism?) If they have too many- what do we do with the extras? :wink: What do we do with a sick illegal that walks in the emergency room or is brought in by ambulance after an auto wreck- turn them away- throw them on the streets?

I agree the illegals are a major part of the problem-- but the only answer to that is secure the borders and deport all that are here...Which isn't going to happen...Not with the Dems wanting more Latino voters and the Repubs and Chamber of Commerce/Big Industry lobby wanting more semislave labor and pool boys, maids, and nannies for the wealthy....

Much of the system needs overhaul- and brought into the 21st Century-- from setting up common billing systems to cut paperwork/costs to broadband transfer of medical records- to access to cheaper drugs- to rules and regs putting all the insurance companies on level playing ground...
Usually I oppose major lump sum bills-- but every time they've tryed to do something on a one issue by one issue basis-- the lobbyists that are profiteering (insurance-pharmaceutical- medical equipment industries) can buy enough Congressment and have been able to kill them or make them ineffective...

 

[aplusmnt]

I am sure many get good health care in Canada! Someone has to be getting care or there would not be those waiting for care that are complaining.

I went to a Garth Brooks Concert once and hated it! My friend was there and he loved it. Maybe the difference was he got tickets Center front stage 5th row up and me and wife ended up in the nose bleed seats! I did not complain though because I got what I paid for!

Problem is in Canada everyone pays the same so why should some be happy with care and get service while others wait in pain or to die? And yes they do die that is why Cancer survival rate is behind the U.S. even though they all get free medical!

See again your wrong .No people do not all pay the same in Canada for medical care......Geeze I wish you would at least know what you tell others ....I do not get free medical...I do however get affordable medical......

Do you have special % held out of your taxes for Health Insurance? If so I did not realize that, otherwise it comes out of the General Tax fund that belongs equally to every citizen.

But even if I misspoke you have it backwards if nothing else, meaning those that pay more still get the same service of the lesser paying, what kind of fair is that?

 

[aplusmnt]

And yes they do die that is why Cancer survival rate is behind the U.S. even though they all get free medical!

And the U.S. has a higher infant mortality rate, so is that better? :???: :???: A person could cherry pick statistics all day, and still not come to a true conclusion.

Alberta seems to be one province where the grumbling about the health care system is the loudest. I wonder how much of this unhappiness is due to the huge explosion in population in Alberta over the past ten years, and the speed or lack of speed that the medical community has shown in keeping up with it? Yhe population growth in Calgary alone has been phenomenal, and would put a strain on any medical system, no matter how it is set up. In provinces where the growth in demand has been more stable, they seem to be keeping up better.

I have explained this before in more detail in other post, but in short summary. The infant mortality rate is skewed, not all countries report infant deaths the same, as well as the U.S. has a large African American population which have a larger mortality rate by race. Also things like Obesity come into play.

You will have to come up with something else to compare Apples to Apples some area where Canada excels past the U.S. some area where actual treatment of a disease is counted, not some reporting discrepancy.

We can rule out Breast Cancer, we can rule out Cancer as a whole, I think but correct me if I am wrong we can rule out Heart Disease also!

Surely you can find some area where treatment in Canada proved to be better than the U.S.?

 

[hypocritexposer]

Reader, you're stut, stut, stut, stuttering. :wink:

did the double post happen on it's own, or did you need to edit it to do that?

 

[aplusmnt]

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Mrs.Greg erased her post and is waving bye again like a 10 year old.

Seriously this conversation was not uncivil, she ran because it brought facts to her opinion and now she took her ball and went home! If threads like this are what makes her claim she is leaving Ranchers, then I just lost any respect I had for her. In other words she is willing to talk politics about the U.S. but has no backbone to discuss facts about Canadian politics!

:roll:

You're just a dude looking for a scrap imho. Regardless of what she says or what she knows, you dismiss it.

It's not a civil discussion. It's a scrap.

Please go back through this thread, I did not delete my post and show me where I said anything nasty or off of subject to Mrs.Greg???????? I debated the issues, and pointed out where she is contradicting someone who also has experience even more than herself.

She caved under in a fair fight, I did not do anything dirty or nasty to her!

 

[Tam]

Oh I expect she will be back in about two to three weeks give or take a month or so, as that is how long the waiting lines are in Alberta to see a doctor to bandage the booboo on her ego. :roll: No wait she is not like the over 100,000 Canadians that have to sit on a waiting list, she is one of the lucky ones that has never ever had to sit on a waiting list isn't she. She'll be back after a few glasses of wine, all primed and ready to dodge the debate with insults. :wink:

I think you need an Orgasm reader. Is that being consistently civil?

Do you and Big Muddy sit around all day telling each other how great you are-- and how much Holier than Thou you are above everyone else :???:

I hope you didn't leave too big a yellow puddle on the floor as you jumped up and down shouting "Looky - I Won, I Won, I Won Big Muddy- I ran off another evil person that had the gall to disagree with us"...

Civil R NOT Us at Tammy and Big Muddy's house.

Reader Was your little buddy Hurleyjd, that you were DEFENDING saying he was "consistantly civil", civil when he made the same comment to me? Or did you not know he had said the EXACT SAME COMMENT TO ME.

HYPOCRITE IS YOU reader :wink:

 

[aplusmnt]

Tam - you and your husband stooped to a new low today. It doesn't warrant further discussion because it speaks for itself.

Did I miss something what was the low?

 

[Mike]

Tam - you and your husband stooped to a new low today. It doesn't warrant further discussion because it speaks for itself.

Did I miss something what was the low?

They suggested a (one) Organism and she wants Multiples. :lol:

 

[Tam]

Tam - you and your husband stooped to a new low today. It doesn't warrant further discussion because it speaks for itself.

Did I miss something what was the low?

BMR stooped so low to use a liberals comment that the liberal used on me on Reader and when she found it disgusting she showed what a hypocrite she is as Reader had already defended the original poster saying he was CONSISTANLY CIVIL. Liberals are civil when they use low class comments but when a conservative use the same they hit a new low. :wink:

 

[aplusmnt]

Is this all over a comment about getting laid? I can not find it but thought I remember it towards someone?

 

[Tam]

And your husband showed an extreme lack of manners. If he was p****d at hurleyjd, he should have addressed him.

Bringing me into what was a fight between hurleyjd and your husband over your honor I guess was low.

Reader YOU defended Hurleyjd by saying he was CONSISTANTLY CIVIL.

Was he CONSISTANTLY CIVIL when he used that same low comment on me? If he was then you are a HYPOCRITE to think BMR was when he using the same low comment on YOU. and if he wasn't then you are a LIAR when you defended him. Did you get it this time or does it need to be explained
S L O W E R :roll:

 

[aplusmnt]

If the rude remark was you need to get laid, what is rude about it? I tell the wife that all the time and even offer to help her with the problem! :wink: :lol:

 

[alice]

Is this all over a comment about getting laid? I can not find it but thought I remember it towards someone?

hurleyjd made a rude remark to Tam.

Tam's rude husband out of the blue decided to direct that remark at me instead of taking it up with hurleyjd. I guess he's a chicken and would rather pick on a woman. Or just an illogical and rude fool.

I guess he's a chicken and would rather pick on a woman.

He's not the only one...

Alice