Does the united States need a beef export market ?

[Clarencen]

mrj:
While I do not agree 100% with you, I always respect your opinion and your alliance with the NBCA. They have done some things that really do benifit us. I won't belong to the NBCA becaus I believe they are top heavy with the monied and the arrogant. They do not see things through the eyes of the average producer.

I have read and re-read the post you made yesterday morning at 9:31. This is why I am making a comment. You state that the auto worker makes $75 an hour, that may be about right when all their benifits are included. It makes me wonder, why you support an organization that finds it acceptable for a cattle producer to invest a couple of millian dollars, then work 16 hours a day for just a subsistence income for his family. I can not see why you would even want your kids and grand kids to inherit a ranch for that kind of a return. Why don't you just tell them to go buy a lunch bucket and work for General Motors

 

[HAY MAKER]

Tuesday, September 25, 2007, 3:16 PM

by Peter Shinn

The Cattlemen's Beef Board (CBB) last week figured out how it planned to spend its $46.8 million budget for the 2008 fiscal year. That budget represents a 9% decrease from the current fiscal year.

CBB Chairman Ken Stielow is a beef producer from Paradise, Kansas. He told Brownfield a number of factors contributed to this year's smaller budget.

"The cattle inventory in the United States isn't growing and the imported assessments were down," Stielow explained. "And then also, we've been doing a better job of budgeting and using our funds, so that in the past, we've had some carryover funds to budget into the new budget each year and this year we just didn't have that - we'd used 'em up."

That leaner budget, Stielow said, led the CBB Beef Promotion Operating Committee to reject $1.8 million in program requests. And according to Stielow, many of the rejected requests for beef checkoff dollars involved research.

"Well, it gets pretty tough," Stielow conceded. "This year, where we were down a little bit, the area that probably got the biggest hit was research."

Some in the beef industry have suggested doubling the beef checkoff from its current rate of $1 per head to $2 a head. Stielow declined to comment directly on that proposal. But speaking strictly as a Kansas rancher, Stielow said he was confident the Beef Checkoff would put those extra funds to good use.

"I think the money would be well spent," said Stielow. "Let's just leave it at that."

As a practical matter, an increase in the beef checkoff assessment, which has remained at a $1 per head since it was approved by Congress in the 1985 farm bill, is highly unlikely to change. Doing so would require an act of Congress, and no cattlemen's association is pressing the issue on Capitol Hill.

In the meantime, the CBB last week decided to spend $22.8 million for advertising and promotion in fiscal year 2008, nearly half the annual beef checkoff budget. $7.4 will go to beef research, $6.3 million toward public relations and

$5.25 million to foreign marketing efforts.

 

[Sandhusker]

Will that money used for foreign marketing be promoting US sourced product or beef in general?

 

[HAY MAKER]

Will that money used for foreign marketing be promoting US sourced product or beef in general?

Believe we all know that answer,but it could be interesting after Sept/08
good luck

 

[Maple Leaf Angus]

Say Hay Maker, have you gotten your Michigan Ohio and Indiana cousins talked into stopping the export of their corn into Ontario yet?

 

[Sandhusker]

Will that money used for foreign marketing be promoting US sourced product or beef in general?

Believe we all know that answer,but it could be interesting after Sept/08
good luck

I think I know, too. I'd like to know for sure.

 

[HAY MAKER]

Say Hay Maker, have you gotten your Michigan Ohio and Indiana cousins talked into stopping the export of their corn into Ontario yet?

Nothing I would like to see better than corn stay home,An estimated 875 million bushels left the state of Iowa recently.
I believe the corn deal is going to get worse,before it gets better,exports and ethanol are sure going to have some of us scrambling for an alternate feed source.................good luck

 

[mrj]

Sorry to be slow to reply. Still catching up after a few days off. Past two days running errands ALL day, putting on about 150 miles in 8 different jaunts. Just my job some days!

Boys, your poll here showed that we believe we DO need to export US beef by 64% yes to 36% no.

Some producers will continue to bury their heads and insist they "raise cattle, not beef" as is often stated by some current directors of R-CALF.

Others understand that 95% of consumers live outside the USA and that exports are key to the future of the US cattle/beef industry, as well as that US cattle producers ARE better off if more beef is sold than if less beef is sold.

My guess is Beef Checkoff efforts overseas is promoting US beef. Now, if there is some imported beef that tops the quality levels and cuts needed for that market, maybe some of it is imported first. The importers pay a significant percentage of the beef checkoff total, so obviously it is fair to advertise ALL beef.

Since import contributions to the checkoff are not separated into different categories, it can be safely seen as imports are contributing to ALL beef checkoff programs.

clarence, I respect you as well, and am surprised you assume that NCBA should be different than the general population in having an occasional "monied" or "arrogant" person as a member.

Don't we all know plenty of people, both "monied" and those less well off ,who are arrogant?

I have known a few "arrogant" appearing people within NCBA whose "arrogance" actually is confidence in their own expertise and knowledge of the subject they are working with for the organization. And often, when one becomes acquainted, the 'arrogance' disappears! If some people find "arrogance" offensive, I'm sorry, but sometimes we have to work with people whose expertise is more than our own. It would be nice if they were 'perfect in every way' to go along with their expertise and knowledge, but we can't ALL be perfect!!!! Sometimes it is to our benefit to learn to work with the less pleasant people for the benefit of us all.

And the contributions to the entire cattle industry of many, many "monied" people are absolutely phenomenal. Should we refuse to accept their money and keep them out of our organizations?

Regarding the profitability or lack thereof for cattle producer: There are low cost producers who are making rather large profits today. There are higher cost producers for MANY reasons, who are not doing as well. Some blame all financial problems on packers. It stands to reason that onerous government regulation of agriculture has an effect. Indebtedness due to estate taxes has an effect that we has hurt our generation and our parents generation. Estate planning isn't the end all and be all unless it is kept up to date and unexpected deaths and expansions can foul up the best of them. It adds insult to injury to be assumed to have inherited free and clear the land that one must purchase due to death taxes after well made (and expensive!) plans were suddenly found inadquate. Reliance on doing things the "way we always did it", especially in hauling bawling calves to the sale barn, can be very costly to a ranch bottom line. Spending more time finding someone to blame than studying the world as it is today in the cattle business is a BIG financial mistake for too many people, IMO. Believing we can turn time back and ignore world trade is another. The bottom line is, there is no ONE entity or thing, including the best or most prevalent of the conspiracy theories making the rounds these days that is responsible for the difficulties making a living raising cattle. Yet some people are doing well at it. Frustrating, isn't it?

mrj

 

[Sandhusker]

MRJ, "My guess is Beef Checkoff efforts overseas is promoting US beef."

How can they support US beef overseas but not here? That makes no sense. Obviously, the see some value in promoting US beef overseas - why don't they see the same value in promoting US beef here as well?

MRJ, "Others understand that 95% of consumers live outside the USA and that exports are key to the future of the US cattle/beef industry, as well as that US cattle producers ARE better off if more beef is sold than if less beef is sold."

Others understand that the future of the US cattle industry is right here in the US. This is the best market in the world to sell beef and priority should be given to keeping it ours. Others also understand that US cattle producers are only better off if beef from US cattle is sold, beef from foreign sources actually costs US producers due to lost sales. You would think that would be a given, but it's obvious somebody needs to explain that to NCBA leadership.

 

[mrj]

Sandhusker, would you prefer that we NOT advertise USA beef overseas?

I believe there are people far more experienced than I in understanding the the financial ramifications of import/export of beef for the USA. I also believe there are many more who believe that world trade is a fact of life, and ultimately good for the US cattle producer who can adapt to the needs of that market.

You seem to believe that all we need do is close our borders to beef and prices for our cattle will have no upside limits forever after. I just don't believe we can use all the tongues, livers, hearts, and other perfectly good byproducts US consumers don't want and which have greater value overseas. We can't expect to sell ONLY what we don't want or need, with no reciprocal trade, IMO.

Then there is the not so small matter of people of lower incomes in the USA who will not be able to afford our high priced domestic only beef supply. Maybe you think they don't deserve to eat beef, but I want them to have it so when they have better incomes, they will want our higher quality/cost beef.

mrj

 

[Sandhusker]

Where did I say not to trade?

Go read what I wrote again.

 

[Mike]

Then there is the not so small matter of people of lower incomes in the USA who will not be able to afford our high priced domestic only beef supply.

Sounds just like Janet Riley. :lol:

 

[Sandhusker]

Sandhusker, would you prefer that we NOT advertise USA beef overseas?

I believe there are people far more experienced than I in understanding the the financial ramifications of import/export of beef for the USA. I also believe there are many more who believe that world trade is a fact of life, and ultimately good for the US cattle producer who can adapt to the needs of that market.

You seem to believe that all we need do is close our borders to beef and prices for our cattle will have no upside limits forever after. I just don't believe we can use all the tongues, livers, hearts, and other perfectly good byproducts US consumers don't want and which have greater value overseas. We can't expect to sell ONLY what we don't want or need, with no reciprocal trade, IMO.

Then there is the not so small matter of people of lower incomes in the USA who will not be able to afford our high priced domestic only beef supply. Maybe you think they don't deserve to eat beef, but I want them to have it so when they have better incomes, they will want our higher quality/cost beef.

mrj

When we promote beef where ever, we need to promote US beef - that should be a given. It should also be a no-brainer that you don't make any money if your customer chooses your competitor's product - and any non-US product is a competitor.

I didn't say that we don't need exports. What I'm saying is that anybody who says our future lies in exports is either a fool or trying to steer you wrong. The US market is the world's best market to sell beef in - that's why everybody wants access to it. If we don't keep this market in our pocket but instead concentrate on exports, we're in effect ignoring the steak on our own grill for the hot dog on the neighbor's. We need to keep a firm grasp on our domestic market, which we're not doing when we can't promote only our own, can't differentiate it, and don't demand that government take actions to make it the safest in the world. This is just the basics folks.

 

[Longcut]

Sandhusker, would you prefer that we NOT advertise USA beef overseas?

I believe there are people far more experienced than I in understanding the the financial ramifications of import/export of beef for the USA. I also believe there are many more who believe that world trade is a fact of life, and ultimately good for the US cattle producer who can adapt to the needs of that market.

You seem to believe that all we need do is close our borders to beef and prices for our cattle will have no upside limits forever after. I just don't believe we can use all the tongues, livers, hearts, and other perfectly good byproducts US consumers don't want and which have greater value overseas. We can't expect to sell ONLY what we don't want or need, with no reciprocal trade, IMO.

Then there is the not so small matter of people of lower incomes in the USA who will not be able to afford our high priced domestic only beef supply. Maybe you think they don't deserve to eat beef, but I want them to have it so when they have better incomes, they will want our higher quality/cost beef.

mrj

When we promote beef where ever, we need to promote US beef - that should be a given. It should also be a no-brainer that you don't make any money if your customer chooses your competitor's product - and any non-US product is a competitor.

I didn't say that we don't need exports. What I'm saying is that anybody who says our future lies in exports is either a fool or trying to steer you wrong. The US market is the world's best market to sell beef in - that's why everybody wants access to it. If we don't keep this market in our pocket but instead concentrate on exports, we're in effect ignoring the steak on our own grill for the hot dog on the neighbor's. We need to keep a firm grasp on our domestic market, which we're not doing when we can't promote only our own, can't differentiate it, and don't demand that government take actions to make it the safest in the world. This is just the basics folks.

It is one thing to know so little about a topic but quite another to show every one.

Do you have any idea on how the most populous countries are growing in terms of disposable income and their desire to eat more than rice? The US domestic market is very small compared to the potential of the rest of the world.

Selling beef involves much more than just selling steaks.

 

[RobertMac]

Sandhusker, would you prefer that we NOT advertise USA beef overseas?

I believe there are people far more experienced than I in understanding the the financial ramifications of import/export of beef for the USA.
You seem to believe that all we need do is close our borders to beef and prices for our cattle will have no upside limits forever after. I just don't believe we can use all the tongues, livers, hearts, and other perfectly good byproducts US consumers don't want and which have greater value overseas. We can't expect to sell ONLY what we don't want or need, with no reciprocal trade, IMO.

Then there is the not so small matter of people of lower incomes in the USA who will not be able to afford our high priced domestic only beef supply. Maybe you think they don't deserve to eat beef, but I want them to have it so when they have better incomes, they will want our higher quality/cost beef.

mrj

MRJ, what percentage of the population living outside the USA can afford to pay current prices for our beef? And of those countries that can afford it, how many don't have some sort of restriction on USA beef?

Just a side note: If I remember correctly from Agman, the majority of our export products were the under utilized products...like tongue, heart, liver, tripe...

The other half of this issue...Where is the cost reduction coming from so that the majority of that 95% outside the US and low income USA consumers can afford our beef? As professed loudly here, packers and retailers are already cut to the bone...so who's pocket are those dollars coming from?????? How many of us can survive at less than $50.00 fats?

I also believe there are many more who believe that world trade is a fact of life, and ultimately good for the US cattle producer who can adapt to the needs of that market.

Have you thought about who is promoting this idea???? The same folks that are working for free trade agreements with BEEF PRODUCING COUNTRIES...and developing GRAINFED BEEF infrastructure in those countries...and don't want COOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Sandhusker]

Longcut, "It is one thing to know so little about a topic but quite another to show every one.

Do you have any idea on how the most populous countries are growing in terms of disposable income and their desire to eat more than rice? The US domestic market is very small compared to the potential of the rest of the world.

Selling beef involves much more than just selling steaks.

Yes, I know about disposable incomes rising in certain countries in the world and the opportunity to market into those economies. I'm not saying that we shouldn't try to get in those markets. What I'm saying is that we are smack dab in the middle of the best market in the world and our FIRST PRIORITY has to be to maximize our efforts here. Only a fool would concentrate on $100 sales 1000 miles away when there are $200 sales to be had in 10 miles away. After your first priority of maximizing sales in your backyard is reached, your SECOND PRIORITY is to protect that lucrative turf. Your THIRD PRIORITY is working those outside markets.

 

[Clarencen]

Atta-boy Sandhusker:


You finally put it altogether in just two paragraphs. You are exactly right. I know this is not the way some on this board really feel, but it does appear to me that they want to chase the export market so bad that they forget about our own domestic market.

I suppose my point of view differs from some, but as I look back at history, I see that our country was built on the concept of providing opportunities for the fellow who was near the bottom but wanted to reach upward. Today it appears that those near the top want to remain where they are but to h---l with the little fellow. When I mention arrogant these are the people I refer to.

 

[RobertMac]

It is one thing to know so little about a topic but quite another to show every one.

Do you have any idea on how the most populous countries are growing in terms of disposable income and their desire to eat more than rice? The US domestic market is very small compared to the potential of the rest of the world.

Selling beef involves much more than just selling steaks.

Why are the packers that control your industry not jumping on those markets with your beef????????????

 

[RobertMac]

Atta-boy Sandhusker:


You finally put it altogether in just two paragraphs. You are exactly right. I know this is not the way some on this board really feel, but it does appear to me that they want to chase the export market so bad that they forget about our own domestic market.

I suppose my point of view differs from some, but as I look back at history, I see that our country was built on the concept of providing opportunities for the fellow who was near the bottom but wanted to reach upward. Today it appears that those near the top want to remain where they are but to h---l with the little fellow. When I mention arrogant these are the people I refer to.

This is my problem with large multi-nationals that are direct competitors with small business. They import products from countries that don't have our rules, regulations, restriction, taxes, and, not to mention, abuse of their labor force and they are driving small USA businesses out of business!

 

[Sandhusker]

Atta-boy Sandhusker:


You finally put it altogether in just two paragraphs. You are exactly right. I know this is not the way some on this board really feel, but it does appear to me that they want to chase the export market so bad that they forget about our own domestic market.

I suppose my point of view differs from some, but as I look back at history, I see that our country was built on the concept of providing opportunities for the fellow who was near the bottom but wanted to reach upward. Today it appears that those near the top want to remain where they are but to h---l with the little fellow. When I mention arrogant these are the people I refer to.

This is my problem with large multi-nationals that are direct competitors with small business. They import products from countries that don't have our rules, regulations, restriction, taxes, and, not to mention, abuse of their labor force and they are driving small USA businesses out of business!

Yep. And what really burns my rear is the fact that small business' are the driver of our economy, but our clods in Washington do what big business wants even when it hurts small business! Talk about biting the hand that feeds you...