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recap of my day

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Northern Rancher said:
You betcha if i have to monkey with a cow during calving she's a gone goose-there's only been one in the last ten years or so that I can remember. I got dumb ids they never learned the fundamentals pulling calves,shoving prolapses in, milking out bad teats or trimming feet. I hope the next generation grows up just as dumb.
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K.... I think it best I just sloooowly back away from this conversation before it regresses to the absurd..... :shock: :lol:
 
Sounds like maybe it was a twisted uterus?

As far as culling......we mostly follow mother natures lead, and cull heavily as she would do if noone was there to help. Not selling something that had prolapsed hadn't even occured to me :???:
 
Cal said:
Sounds like maybe it was a twisted uterus?

As far as culling......we mostly follow mother natures lead, and cull heavily as she would do if noone was there to help. Not selling something that had prolapsed hadn't even occured to me :???:
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I try to do such a good job hiding the stitches, that sometimes I forget and keep the cow. :roll: :-)

Seriously, I sure try to get rid of the cows with vaginal prolapses, but have kept over the ones with uterine prolapses and they've never done it again.

We probably average about one uterine prolapse per year, and it is never a fun experience. One morning, Peach came in from checking cows and said, "We've got a prolapse." I was grumbling around and getting decked out in an old coat, when she said, "April Fool." This made my day. :-)
 
I'm puzzled with all the "ruthless culling" guys - shipping problem cows so they won't do something again is fair enough - but in cases where there is no greater chance of them having the problem again (like a uterine prolapse) than any other cow in the herd it's a bit like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. If it's the work and hassle of treating things you don't like why not just shoot the problem cases when you see them and be done with it. That way it would save you the work you don't like doing. Doing the work to save them then shipping them for no good reason doesn't seem very well thought out - in cases where the problem is no more likely to occur to that cow again than any other member of the herd
 
Silver said:
RSL said:
The only thing a prolapse (of any kind) is good for is a story...
For the record, the last and only one I remember at our place in the last 15 years lived just long enough to raise her calf (which did not enter the replacement pen). :shock:
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Do you ship all your cows that calve and the calf has a head or leg back too? :shock: :lol:
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:D a leg back is a few minutes of work. A prolapse might be, but if you don't get enough of them, you forget your training and it can take a while. A cow owes me for that labour. The other problem is that it can make her miss a cycle or two and the final straw is that usually by the time you stuff outside back inside you are damn mad at that cow. As I recall we milked a cow once in the last 15 years too...

It maybe personal preference but I hate messing around with cows that have problems and it is pretty rare a cow will ever get a second chance, so I guess I will have to live with never knowing if prolapses are inherited (they are) or if they recur in the future (they might but not at my house).
FWIW :lol:
 
It's such a really small percent that prolapse that getting rid of them isn't a big item, but on the off chance that there's some heritable uterine attachment issue, or some other problem....I'd rather not have them or any offspring in the herd. Just a preference for keeping things cleaned up.
 
My experience is that if you have to mess with a cow at calving once, you will more than likely have to mess with her again. Maybe not for the same problem. I try to save the lives of all these problems once and then load them on the truck when they have weaned a calf. That way I have the dollars the animal was worth and not the expense of a bullet.
I enjoy listening to the radio in the tractor cab, arguing on Ranchers and watching healthy cattle doing their own job too much to spend my time sewing them up and poking a teat in a calf's mouth. I do what I have to with a problem but after that it leaves on the earliest bus convenient.

Each to his own. I tried the other way already.
 
Let's take this one step farther. Hypothetically, would anyone care to buy a bull that was out of a cow that prolapsed when he was born? Would you even care to know?
 
Cal said:
Let's take this one step farther. Hypothetically, would anyone care to buy a bull that was out of a cow that prolapsed when he was born? Would you even care to know?
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I don't want bulls that have had any human intervention in their first days of life, or any problems with their dam. (other than tagging and weighing)
This is one of the reasons we have kept a lot of our own in the last few years.
I will throw this question back at you though Cal. How do you know for sure these AI sires you are using come from problem free cattle?
 
Most cows you give second chances too come back and bite you in the ash somewhere down the line. I just don't like cows around that have caused me grief-since we calve out in the bush-Wiley Coyote will take care of any prolapses out there.
 
Cal said:
Let's take this one step farther. Hypothetically, would anyone care to buy a bull that was out of a cow that prolapsed when he was born? Would you even care to know?
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Wouldn't care to know. It is not a genetic trait so it is completely meaningless. However, it could be she prolapsed because of a difficult delivery because of birthweight. Birth weight is largely genetic and therefore is a handy tool for selection purposes.
 
Some of you make me laugh my ash off.

A uterine prolapse is a fluke at best, and if you have pulled the calf ,more than likely it is you adding to the prob. and causing it .

Show heifer or not when she was AI'd you should have felt her pelvic region to make sure it was fully developed enough. More than likely this heifer should never have been retained to begin with..

Sorry about your ordeal ,but she needs to hit the road,, not because she prolapsed but because she couldn't calve on her own..

More so because she is a show animal ,you need stricter policies than just a commercial terminal breeder does ..
 
Well it's a fluke that would eliminate itself out in mother nature. We sell replacement cattle for ALOT more than the going market just because we cull like we do.Just talked to an outfit bought twoloads from us two years ago-his cowboss wanted to hug me-people appreciate trouble free cattle and are willing to pay for them.
 
You can cull all you like for faults but you will still get something every year that needs assistance or she dies or she loses her calf - it's the nature of the beast. Fair enough I agree breeders, especially seedstock producers should try to ruthlessly eliminate cattle that have genetic or heritable faults that require assistance at any time of year. Uterine prolapse is neither a heritable or genetic fault nor is it always associated with large calves. I have seen 3 in my life - two were small calves but the cows were badly positioned (head up a hill, butt down - it happens if you have rough terrain) The third was a heifer that should not have been bred to the bull she was.
At the same time the majority of purebred herds (and many of the commercial posters on this forum) assist right left and centre - there is a whole culture built on the big drama of "calving time" with the hourly checks all night, bringing cows in, penning them up etc etc - what's that all about if no-one assists and everyone ships all their problems? There are many purebred herds I have seen selling bulls right at the top of the trade that regularly pull calves, assist calves to suckle, put stupid ear warming mitts on their calves because they choose to winter calf and plenty buyers are eager to buy their pampered bulls.
I check and tag my newborns twice a day and sleep through the night because I calf at an appropriate time of year but I won't ship a cow with a uterine prolapse caused by getting rolled on a bad piece of ground.
 
Well I guess I would lol. Where we calve later in the year we couldn't get to her to save her if we wanted anyway. i did have a heifer calve out a calf with a leg back once-it was dead but she got it out somewhere in the willows.
 
hillsdown said:
Some of you make me laugh my ash off.

A uterine prolapse is a fluke at best, and if you have pulled the calf ,more than likely it is you adding to the prob. and causing it .

Show heifer or not when she was AI'd you should have felt her pelvic region to make sure it was fully developed enough. More than likely this heifer should never have been retained to begin with..

Sorry about your ordeal ,but she needs to hit the road,, not because she prolapsed but because she couldn't calve on her own..

More so because she is a show animal ,you need stricter policies than just a commercial terminal breeder does ..
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FWIW, this really isn't a "show cow". MCG wanted an AI bred heifer project to show at the 4-H fair. She had one she was working on but she ended up open. She will hit the road this fall. So we went through the rest of the heifers and she picked out one that was AI bred and looked nice. Brought her home, halter broke her. Took her to the 4-H fair. She ended up calmer than her steer so she showed her in Showmanship. Got Reserve champion. After the fair, we kicked her out back with the herd. She just had a spot in MCG's heart so we've been watching her waiting for her to calve. It's a sad thing this had to happen, our last prolapse was in 1996. When I got home that day we could have just put her out of her misery. We had almost decided to but my soft heart wouldn't let that happen. I felt we should do everything in our power to help her. So we did. It just happened on a day when no one was around...no vets no neighbors no nothing. If she dies she dies if she lives she is down the road. I felt much better about helping her than the other option. So there :!:
 
hillsdown said:
Some of you make me laugh my ash off.

A uterine prolapse is a fluke at best, and if you have pulled the calf ,more than likely it is you adding to the prob. and causing it .

Show heifer or not when she was AI'd you should have felt her pelvic region to make sure it was fully developed enough. More than likely this heifer should never have been retained to begin with..

Sorry about your ordeal ,but she needs to hit the road,, not because she prolapsed but because she couldn't calve on her own..

More so because she is a show animal ,you need stricter policies than just a commercial terminal breeder does ..
Click to expand...


FWIW, this really isn't a "show cow". MCG wanted an AI bred heifer project to show at the 4-H fair. She had one she was working on but she ended up open. She will hit the road this fall. So we went through the rest of the heifers and she picked out one that was AI bred and looked nice. Brought her home, halter broke her. Took her to the 4-H fair. She ended up calmer than her steer so she showed her in Showmanship. Got Reserve champion. After the fair, we kicked her out back with the herd. She just had a spot in MCG's heart so we've been watching her waiting for her to calve. It's a sad thing this had to happen, our last prolapse was in 1996. When I got home that day we could have just put her out of her misery. We had almost decided to but my soft heart wouldn't let that happen. I felt we should do everything in our power to help her. So we did. It just happened on a day when no one was around...no vets no neighbors no nothing. If she dies she dies if she lives she is down the road. I felt much better about helping her than the other option. So there :!: [/b]
 

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