don
Well-known member
i think r-calf figures inferior american standards are the best protection for american cattlemen against imports and to heck with the safety of the consumer.
Sandhusker said:
I see nothing has changed Sandhusker is still ignoring the questions ask of him and not excepting the answer he gets to his questions.
I'll type really slow Sandhusker so you get it. I - d o n' t - k n o w - w h a t - L e o - t h i n k s - I - o n l y - k n o w - w h a t - h e - t e l l s - p e o p l e. If the two don't match then we have a big problem. Which according to you they don't match as on one hand he is telling people the US HAS AND HAS HAD FOR SO MANY YEARS these firewalls and on the other he is thinking the US needs firewalls like Canada has had for so many years.
W H I C H - I S - I T - S A N D H U S K E R, - D O - Y O U - H A V E - A N Y - F I R E W A L L S - P R O T E C T I N G - U S - C O N S U M E R S - F R O M - U S - B O R N - A N D - F E D - B S E - O R - D O N' T - Y O U ???
By the way what do you think of Marsh's 1985 prediction Sandhusker? Who really had the first case of BSE was it poor little UK or was it the big bad USA? :???: :???: :? :roll: I think I smell a mink oh I mean a rat!!!!! :wink:
Sandhusker
Well-known member
And I see nothing has changed with you, Tam. You still choose to misinterpret simple statements. If you want to discuss what Leo actually said, we'll discuss. If you want to continue twisting meanings, you can sit with your R-CALF-Is-The-Boogey-Man club members and you can all pretend you're really on to something.
The man has said time and time again that our standards are being compromised, that we need to close the holes in our feed ban, and then you think he followed that up by saying we have the highest standards in the world? You bet, that makes a lot of sense. :roll: If you play stupid long enough, you won't have to play after a while.
What do I think of Marsh's prediction? I think that if you actually believe Marsh and you believe the comment I've heard many times from you and other Canadians that go something like "We've been trading back and forth for 100 years, you have to have what we have", you should be alarmed yourself. Since all I hear is "Canadian beef is safe", I think you obviously don't believe one of your own arguements and that renders anything you bring up as questionable.
The man has said time and time again that our standards are being compromised, that we need to close the holes in our feed ban, and then you think he followed that up by saying we have the highest standards in the world? You bet, that makes a lot of sense. :roll: If you play stupid long enough, you won't have to play after a while.
What do I think of Marsh's prediction? I think that if you actually believe Marsh and you believe the comment I've heard many times from you and other Canadians that go something like "We've been trading back and forth for 100 years, you have to have what we have", you should be alarmed yourself. Since all I hear is "Canadian beef is safe", I think you obviously don't believe one of your own arguements and that renders anything you bring up as questionable.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Sounds like Tam and Kathy been sniffing the same corks again :wink: :lol: Just because one guy or one book says it- and comes up with some conspiracy to sell the book--- it doesn't become gospel......
The one major fact is that there hasn't been a POST feedban animal found in the US and the last animal found was born over 12 years ago....To me that is evidence that our feedban and prevention/eradication system has worked....
If Canada could go 12 years without a case-- then I'd say thats evidence their feedban and eradication system has worked/is working......But we know that has not been the case....
The one major fact is that there hasn't been a POST feedban animal found in the US and the last animal found was born over 12 years ago....To me that is evidence that our feedban and prevention/eradication system has worked....
If Canada could go 12 years without a case-- then I'd say thats evidence their feedban and eradication system has worked/is working......But we know that has not been the case....
If you say a phrase enough times you may beging to believe it even thought it is false that is how a cult convinces it followers to do what ever the leader wants it is called brain washing. It is common practice for people who show cattle in the US to feed melatonin to get the animals to grow more hair. Although there are supplements that stimulate melatonin productions, feeding melatonin directly achieves more hair growth so more and more people go that way . The problem with this is the melatonin is derrived from ground cow brains and although it isn't meant for bovines to consume it is. So once again the feedban being broken in the US but this time cattle are being fed 5 grams of cow brains per feeding it would work out that a FFA or 4-H heifer would eat melatonin from up to 3 different cow per day for 3 years of showing. This will really help :roll: . Maybe enfore the rules 
!!!!! Of course r-calf says the US has no other animals with BSE so this isn't a risk or so the logic would follow. The problem is if they are wrong and the are more BSE positive cows running around the US the problem will get worse and worse until it can not be hidden any more. DENY all you want the OIE states that the US should be finding 2-3 indeginous BSE positives per year since 2003 so that should be from 8 - 12 positives and they found how many - 2. Too bad those other positives bse animals went into the human and animal feedchain. It is like watching a guy trying to smoke a stick of TNT it is a matter of time and it won't end well.
!!!!! Of course r-calf says the US has no other animals with BSE so this isn't a risk or so the logic would follow. The problem is if they are wrong and the are more BSE positive cows running around the US the problem will get worse and worse until it can not be hidden any more. DENY all you want the OIE states that the US should be finding 2-3 indeginous BSE positives per year since 2003 so that should be from 8 - 12 positives and they found how many - 2. Too bad those other positives bse animals went into the human and animal feedchain. It is like watching a guy trying to smoke a stick of TNT it is a matter of time and it won't end well.:shock: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Sandhusker Please explain to Oldtimer what holes those are as Oldtimer seems to think your feedban has done it's job and has eradicated BSE in the US. :lol: :lol:
While we are at it can we have Haymaker our third voice of R-CALF logic wade in and tell us which way it is.
Has the US feedban eradicated BSE like fellow R-CALFER Oldtimer claims or has it been compromised like your other fellow R-CALFER Sandhusker claims? IS BSE a threat to US consumers or not? Is US Beef the world safest beef raised to the world's highest standards like R-CALF claims or is it a Genuine Risk of Death like R-CALF's Federal Judge Cebull claimed all beef coming from a BSE effected country is? I'm confused :???: :? :lol: :lol: :lol:
But But Sandhusker believes Leo means.Oldtimer said:
Sandhusker Please explain to Oldtimer what holes those are as Oldtimer seems to think your feedban has done it's job and has eradicated BSE in the US. :lol: :lol:
While we are at it can we have Haymaker our third voice of R-CALF logic wade in and tell us which way it is.
Has the US feedban eradicated BSE like fellow R-CALFER Oldtimer claims or has it been compromised like your other fellow R-CALFER Sandhusker claims? IS BSE a threat to US consumers or not? Is US Beef the world safest beef raised to the world's highest standards like R-CALF claims or is it a Genuine Risk of Death like R-CALF's Federal Judge Cebull claimed all beef coming from a BSE effected country is? I'm confused :???: :? :lol: :lol: :lol:
Oldtimer said:
Gee March predicted Atypical BSE was in the US in 1985 and guess what that same strain was found in the US years later. Not the classic strain that everyone else found but the very RARE strain he predicted would be found. What are the odds Oldtimer? :roll:
A
Anonymous
Guest
TAMMY-- You can squirrel it around anyway you want and quote Shakespeare in your hatred of your home country and to make the US and R-CALF out to be the evil ones for all I care-- The fact is the Canada has found 12 positive BSE cattle- 6 of which were born POST feedban- some born only 4 or 5 years ago-- with Canada having a history of verified BSE as far back as 1993- and the fact that Canada is still finding positive cattle.....Your feedban has not worked-which CFIA admitted when they implemented the new feedban this year.....Which has left the head BSE/TSE expert in Canada, Dr. Cashman, to say that their are possibly 50 BSE positive cattle in Canada-- and our US CDC to say that Canadian cattle pose a risk 26 times that of US cattle........
The US has tested almost a million cattle now-- and found only 2 origin cases- both atypical- and both born before the feedban was mandatory...No cattle born in the last 12 years have been found--which to me is evidence that the feedban, quarantines, and all firewalls combined have worked-- but that does not mean the feedban alone can prevent it, if we begin importing from a higher risk country like Canada...
No Canuck has yet to answer Sandhuskers question.....You can Tammmy..
How are you going to guarantee that none of those 50 or so infected cattle enter the US??? :???:
Remember-- USDA and all the BSE/TSE experts have said the number one prevention measure for keeping BSE out of/ or additional BSE out of the country is quarantine-- the same reason Canada has quarantined out the beef from approximately 25 countries now.....
The US has tested almost a million cattle now-- and found only 2 origin cases- both atypical- and both born before the feedban was mandatory...No cattle born in the last 12 years have been found--which to me is evidence that the feedban, quarantines, and all firewalls combined have worked-- but that does not mean the feedban alone can prevent it, if we begin importing from a higher risk country like Canada...
No Canuck has yet to answer Sandhuskers question.....You can Tammmy..
How are you going to guarantee that none of those 50 or so infected cattle enter the US??? :???:
Remember-- USDA and all the BSE/TSE experts have said the number one prevention measure for keeping BSE out of/ or additional BSE out of the country is quarantine-- the same reason Canada has quarantined out the beef from approximately 25 countries now.....
Sandhusker
Well-known member
Tam, "Sandhusker Please explain to Oldtimer what holes those are as Oldtimer seems to think your feedban has done it's job and has eradicated BSE in the US. "
What are you getting into his face for, you've got nothing to prove that it hasn't.
What are you getting into his face for, you've got nothing to prove that it hasn't.
OK Miss Tam,you asked....... #1 can we have Haymaker our third voice of R-CALF logic wade in and tell us which way it is.
Yes mam you can
#2 Has the US feedban eradicated BSE like fellow R-CALFER Oldtimer claims
It is my humble opinion,the feed ban is working,and unlike Canada is being complied with.
#3 or has it been compromised like your other fellow R-CALFER Sandhusker claims?
Its obvious to everyone concerned the usda needs to do a better job enforcing the feed ban,but the fact that you have many times the number of positive BSE cases both pre and post with a tenth amount of cattle,tells me our feed ban is being complied with,and yours is not.
#4 IS BSE a threat to US consumers or not?
Yes BSE is a threat to the the US consumer,that's why it is very important we tighten our # 1 firewall which is imports.
#5 Is US Beef the world safest beef raised to the world's highest standards like R-CALF claims
Yes mam it certainly is,and will stay that way if we stay vigilant, maintain our fire walls and limit our imports from BSE infected countries.
#6 or is it a Genuine Risk of Death like R-CALF's Federal Judge Cebull claimed all beef coming from a BSE effected country is?
I tend to agree with the judge,all beef coming from a country that has refused to comply with their feed ban,has many BSE positives both pre and post,are definetly high Risk.
#7 I'm confused
What's new.
good luck
Yes mam you can
#2 Has the US feedban eradicated BSE like fellow R-CALFER Oldtimer claims
It is my humble opinion,the feed ban is working,and unlike Canada is being complied with.
#3 or has it been compromised like your other fellow R-CALFER Sandhusker claims?
Its obvious to everyone concerned the usda needs to do a better job enforcing the feed ban,but the fact that you have many times the number of positive BSE cases both pre and post with a tenth amount of cattle,tells me our feed ban is being complied with,and yours is not.
#4 IS BSE a threat to US consumers or not?
Yes BSE is a threat to the the US consumer,that's why it is very important we tighten our # 1 firewall which is imports.
#5 Is US Beef the world safest beef raised to the world's highest standards like R-CALF claims
Yes mam it certainly is,and will stay that way if we stay vigilant, maintain our fire walls and limit our imports from BSE infected countries.
#6 or is it a Genuine Risk of Death like R-CALF's Federal Judge Cebull claimed all beef coming from a BSE effected country is?
I tend to agree with the judge,all beef coming from a country that has refused to comply with their feed ban,has many BSE positives both pre and post,are definetly high Risk.
#7 I'm confused
What's new.
good luck
Sandhusker
Well-known member
Tam, "...or has it been compromised like your other fellow R-CALFER Sandhusker claims?"
Where did I say it had been compromised?
Where did I say it had been compromised?
Sandhusker said:
And while you are answering sandhusker Miss Tam,maybe you would like to explain how five of the 11 cases of BSE in Canada came in cattle born after March 1, 1999 which is the date a Canadian feed ban to prevent BSE went into effect................good luck
Sandhusker said:
So you don't agree with what you said Leo has been telling everyone that will listen And your feedban hasn't been compromised? If it hasn't been compromised and it has eradicated what BSE the US did have then why can't it eradicate any BSE that may be imported? What is the big huge risk to the US cattle herd if your feed ban is working and everyone is complying to it? :???: And where is the big huge risk from our beef if your beef that had BSE is not an issue and never was?
Sandhusker
Well-known member
Tam said:
What I don't agree with is what you claim I said. I didn't say it. You have a problem with language - understanding who said what and what the communication was. It makes it impossible to have a debate with you.
Oldtimer said:
Oldtimer the fact is we have looked to see how big our problem may be unlike you.
And the fact you haven't found it only begs the question why don't you look where the world expects you to look? ON YOUR FARMS AND RANCHES
I recieved this response from a very connected US person when we were discussing our testing verse what you call testing.
and in a previous email he explained why Montana never met their State or regional quota on testing, as they have no "slaughter plants" in Montana and Montana's test samples were counted in the state where their animals are sent to "SLAUGHTER".
Now where in the recommended OIE testing does it say if you want to find the highest risk animals of having BSE test slaughter animals? :roll: If you want to compare risk to risk test your on farm dead and dieing and let us compare apples to apples. Until then you have nothing to back your claims of safer beef.
And Oldtimer what should it matter if you import one or two according to you your feedban eradicated it once and it is still being enforced so what is the likelyhood that BSE will ever get passed your BSE eradication firewalls this time. Either your firewalls worked and are working or they are not which is it?
Sandhusker
Well-known member
Tam, "Oldtimer the fact is we have looked to see how big our problem may be unlike you."
And what did you find? Exactly what was the infection rate?
And what did you find? Exactly what was the infection rate?
Sandhusker said:
No you didn't say it but do you agree with what LEO SAID about your feedban with holes in it or do you agree with Oldtimer and the US feedban did exactly what it was to do and eradicated BSE? If it did eradicate BSE in the US then why can't it now protect you and your consumers from anything that MIGHT be imported? If it had holes like LEO SAID then how did it eradicate US BSE? You can't have it both ways Sandhusker pick a side or are you going to do the usual flip flopping that we have all become accustom to from you R-CALFers. :roll:
Sandhusker
Well-known member
Tam, "No you didn't say it but do you agree with what LEO SAID about your feedban with holes in it or do you agree with Oldtimer and the US feedban did exactly what it was to do and eradicated BSE? If it did eradicate BSE in the US then why can't it now protect you and your consumers from anything that MIGHT be imported? If it had holes like LEO SAID then how did it eradicate US BSE? You can't have it both ways Sandhusker pick a side or are you going to do the usual flip flopping that we have all become accustom to from you R-CALFers'
"No you didn't say it but..." Then why did you say I said it? Doesn't slow you down a bit, does it? Just keep on going. I think you should change your avitar to the Energizer Bunny. :lol:
First of all, I didn't see where OT contradicted or disagreed with Leo. I can't answer a question on an event that you made up. What is your question anyway? Holes in the ban or the question on our infectivity?
"No you didn't say it but..." Then why did you say I said it? Doesn't slow you down a bit, does it? Just keep on going. I think you should change your avitar to the Energizer Bunny. :lol:
First of all, I didn't see where OT contradicted or disagreed with Leo. I can't answer a question on an event that you made up. What is your question anyway? Holes in the ban or the question on our infectivity?
HAY MAKER said:
Tell us Haymaker if your US feedban was fully complied to and eradicated BSE in the US like you and Oldtimer claim, then just how much better was the USDA to enforce it? Sounds like you should be congratulating them not ragging on their screw ups!!!
Great way to sell beef Haymaker telling everyone beef coming from a BSE counrty is a genuine risk of death when the world knows the US closer yet your great state of TEXAS has found BSE!!!!
And Do us all a favor and read the GOA report on the US feedban compliance will you!! Then do a google search on recalled contaminated ruminant feed in the US. Let's see who is refusing to comply.
