Subsidies

[mwj]

Jinglebob you are on the money when you say we all get subsadised in one way or another. It is just human nature to say it is help when I get it but it is welfare when someone else does :shock:

 

[cedardell]

I never used to agree with subsidies for all the reasons listed above. I never took them even though I.m a row crop farmer. However. since NAFTA has opened our market to the whole world and we are getting beef in here from all over the world and not shipping much out, I,d say the govt. owes us subsidies until they level the playing field and balance our trade deficit. How are we to keep up with inflation and the ever decreasing value of the dollar if we can't export as much as we import. One of these days we'll wake up and a bale of baling string will cost more than the hay it encompuses.

 

[Frisco]

Jinglebob said it best. I was trying to recall all the businesses and industries that are subsidized by the government, but Jinglebob got it said concisely and simply. Agriculture and unwed mothers are always singled out as the subsidy poster children, but the automobile industry, airlines, student education... all are subsidized by the US government in some way or another. Loan write-offs, tax breaks, tariffs all affect the "free market" place.
So, yes, US cattle producers are subsidized.

 

[elwapo]

haymaker

Despite record net farm incomes, U.S. doles big cash to growers
Last year was a good one for American farmers. They enjoyed strong prices and record yields, which generated record cash receipts. They are also estimated to have received a generous $14.5 billion U.S. from their government in direct agriculture subsidies.
Virtually all of these subsidies were paid out as a result of the U.S. Farm Bill, signed into law in May 2002. This bill provides funding for commodities, trade, credit and rural development, among other things.
Essentially, the Farm Bill affects what U.S. farmers decide to grow and the risks they're willing to shoulder to grow it. Because subsidies are often linked to the prices or production of specific crops, such as grain for example, it naturally follows that farmers grow these crops in greater abundance.
Subsidized grain is then exported at prices as much as 28 per cent lower than the actual cost of production, according to a recent study by the Minneapolis-based Institute for Agriculture and Trade Policy. Aside from encouraging over-production and depressing world grain prices, this marketing approach ultimately lowers returns for farmers who earn their living from the marketplace.
The U.S. Farm Bill is of concern to western Canadian farmers because the bill contradicts the spirit of the World Trade Organization (WTO) and the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA). For years the U.S. has paid lip service to freer trade and market access, while continuing to throw public money at its own agriculture industry. It's difficult to see this as anything but hypocritical.

 

[HAY MAKER]

Yes elwapo we know,farmers do alright with subsidies,now tell me what that has to do with the cattle industry ?..........good luck

 

[Big Muddy rancher]

Gee Haymaker didn't you know that cattle eat corn to fatten? you know that cheap US corn that is subsidised.

 

[Tam]

Haymaker said this

"No the US cattle man is not subsidized......."

on Sun Sep 03, 2006 3:15 pm

Then in true Haymaker fashion came back with this

Well it's a damn good thing we are

Posted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 8:32 am.

Then

now tell me what that has to do with the cattle industry

Posted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 7:31 pm



Now I know where R-CALF leadership got the flip flopping from. :wink:

 

[HAY MAKER]

Gee Haymaker didn't you know that cattle eat corn to fatten? you know that cheap US corn that is subsidised.

Did'nt you know not everyone fattens cattle ? with corn ?.............good luck

 

[don]

cheap subsidized corn means feeders can pay more for calves. and you guys want a level playing field; we do too.

 

[elwapo]

Yes elwapo we know,farmers do alright with subsidies,now tell me what that has to do with the cattle industry ?..........good luck

I knew that one was coming!!!!!
You are not that dense haymaker.

 

[elwapo]

Global Developement (1995)

-Soybeans and corn are two of the most subsidized agricultural commodities.

-55-65% of US raised corn is utilized by the US livestock industry
-45-50% of US raised soybeans are utilized by the US livestock industry

-17% of total meat production cost is feed

-Subsidized feed is resulting in a 15% reduction in costs to the livestock sector in the US.

 

[elwapo]

That should read

Global Developement 2005

 

[HAY MAKER]

Yes elwapo we know,farmers do alright with subsidies,now tell me what that has to do with the cattle industry ?..........good luck

I knew that one was coming!!!!!
You are not that dense haymaker.

You're right IM not,"if" subsidized feed is resulting in a 15% reduction of costs to the *US*livestock producers,how does that compare to the canadian producer,and Mexicans,where subsidies are a way of life.
It's a fact Mexico and canada,are many times more subsidized than the American producers,and like I stated "not all cattle get fattened here in the states,hence "NO SUBSIDIES...............good luck
PS Im kinda skeptical about this 15%.

 

[HAY MAKER]

cheap subsidized corn means feeders can pay more for calves. and you guys want a level playing field; we do too.

You sound like ~SH~ with that theory,feeders are not going to pay more than they have too,regardless of subsidies,and with packers manipulating prices with their canadian captive supplies,what subsidies that are availible wind up in packers pockets..............good luck

 

[don]

haymaker: It's a fact Mexico and canada,are many times more subsidized than the American producers,and like I stated "not all cattle get fattened here in the states,hence "NO SUBSIDIES...............good luck

check with some reliable sources ike oecd and see where the highest subsidy levels are. facts are pretty subjective here, i guess.

 

[elwapo]

haymaker

It's a fact Mexico and canada,are many times more subsidized than the American producers,

Here are the OECD #s that prove you wrong ..........once again

agricultural subsidies as a percent of GDP

USA = .9%
Mexico = .9%
Canada = .7%

 

[HAY MAKER]

haymaker

It's a fact Mexico and canada,are many times more subsidized than the American producers,

Here are the OECD #s that prove you wrong ..........once again

agricultural subsidies as a percent of GDP

USA = .9%
Mexico = .9%
Canada = .7%

Post the address of this site elwapo,something dont look right,do these numbers include the "BSE"subsidy,do these numbers include the fact that canada has M COOL,so that all the canadian consumers can come to the canadian ranchers rescue,when the border closed ? would you call that a subsidy ? ............good luck

 

[HAY MAKER]

NFU: Canadian Cattle Subsidies Unfair to U.S. Producers



WASHINGTON (July 26, 2005) – National Farmers Union is urging the U.S. Department of Agriculture to take immediate action to ensure that subsidized Canadian cattle production does not compete with the U.S. beef industry.



In response to U.S policy to protect the domestic cattle herd from bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE), the Canadian government instituted up to $200 per head subsidy payments to Canadian cattle producers. Now that the border has been re-opened to Canadian cattle and beef imports, these payments constitute an unfair subsidy of Canadian exports to our country.



"U.S. cattle producers have experienced a drop in prices since the reopening of the border," NFU President Dave Frederickson said. "We need to ensure we are not giving foreign producers a competitive advantage over U.S. producers."



Although this program has been suspended, subsidized cattle are coming into the United States and are in direct competition with domestic cattle. NFU has asked USDA to take the following action:



Request that Canada immediately suspend shipping subsidized Canadian cattle to the United States.



Investigate the Canadian subsidy to see if it violates the WTO or NAFTA trade agreements.



If the Canadian government resists ending subsidization of their cattle industry, initiate a countervailing duty investigation and immediately establish import tariffs to protect the economic interests of U.S. cattle producers

 

[elwapo]

NFU ........ union man are ya.


http://www.oecd.org/home/

 

[Bill]

A thread about a US gov't payment to American producers and of course one of the R-Klowns has to try spin and divert it into something against Canada. :roll: :roll: