TRADE ....... WHY ?

[burnt]

It wouldn't hurt to familiarize yourself with the progress of the work he has done. Then again, maybe it would hurt. Take a little time and research it.

 

[burnt]

Never heard of the guy. Has anybody checked his numbers? That's generally how that is done.

Did a search on "Dr. Paul Brown bse"....the first hit was by..."flounder".

Keep going. flounder does not own Dr. Paul Brown.

 

[Shaft]

Keep going. flounder does not own Dr. Paul Brown.

No, but he certainly apears to own the 2600 infected cattle fed to kids in the US line. The number 2600 likely comes from the 2005 Harvard Risk Assessment where they projected that number as the worst case scenario for the US.

Brown has been all over the BSE-vCJD link since at least 1990. Dr. Richard Marsh has been all over the risk of BSE in the US since well before that. Take a look at his work. I particularly like the final line in his 1990 paper on the assesment of the risk of BSE appearing in the US:

"If we wait for the first case of BSE to occur in the United States, we will have lost the opportunity to prevent this disease by learning from the painful lessons in Great Britain."

What Sandy et al need to remember is that, according to the CFIA;

"The ages of the five BSE cases diagnosed from May 2003 to June 2005 could also support the existence of two temporal BSE clusters in North America. These temporal BSE clusters may have resulted from the initial BSE infection that entered North America through the importation of cattle from the U.K. during the period from 1982 to 1989. One or more of these imported animals, without necessarily demonstrating signs of the disease, may have entered the North American feed system between 1991 and 1992 and caused the first generation of BSE in Canadian cattle. The Texas animal that was born around 1992 could signal the first generation of the disease in the United States."

One infected British cow did the job in Canada. One. Maybe two. Now, finally, Canada has the necessary feed-ban controls, restrictions and testing to stamp out BSE in Canada, what little remains.

One infected cow most likely did the job. To focus on Canadian imports instead of adopting the same or similar strict BSE control policies is to court inevitable disaster. Please get with the program. Please. Sandy, you R-CALFers need to spend the money having your lawyers stomp on APHIS and the FDA to get them off their complacent little butts. You do have a very serious vested interest in that, at least if you intend to have anything to pass on to your daughter at the end of the day. By 2012 Canada will be BSE free and the US may well be in the throes of an epidemic. Please focus on what needs to be done to prevent that. Please. By far the greatest risk factors are within the US itself. By far.

 

[Sandhusker]

Hey, I'm all for more testing and closing the loopholes in our feed ban down here. I've stated that numerous times. You seem to think that I'm in acceptance with how the USDA has handled our situation. That is far from the case. I think we need to get serious about getting rid of the disease. To do that, you start with containment, then identification, then eradication. However, you can't take the first step, containment, when you're knowingly importing it, and that's exactly what we're doing! If you want to get all the flies out of the house, the first thing you do is shut the windows!

 

[Shaft]

Bullshit. When the house is full of flies and the air is fresh and clear outside, the first thing you do is get rid of the flies inside before they infect the food supply and you die.

See you at the 2012 fire sale. I'll be the one bidding 5 cents on the dollar for your whole operation. Best bid you're likely to get the way things are going.

 

[Sandhusker]

BS. When the house is full of flies and the air is fresh and clear outside, the first thing you do is get rid of the flies inside before they infect the food supply and you die.

See you at the 2012 fire sale. I'll be the one bidding 5 cents on the dollar for your whole operation. Best bid you're likely to get the way things are going.

"The air is fresh and clear outside" :roll:

Earth to Shaft; They just found #15 a week ago.

 

[Anonymous]

BS. When the house is full of flies and the air is fresh and clear outside, the first thing you do is get rid of the flies inside before they infect the food supply and you die.

See you at the 2012 fire sale. I'll be the one bidding 5 cents on the dollar for your whole operation. Best bid you're likely to get the way things are going.

"The air is fresh and clear outside" :roll:

Earth to Shaft; They just found #15 a week ago.

And #16 thru #260 could easily have been ground up into hamburger and went into the Canadian food distribution chain before they overtly displayed symptoms :???:

You know that if/when vCJD is discovered in the US- the politicians/bureaucrats will blame it on the Canadian beef coming in and the bad decision to reopen the border to cover their butts for not doing more testing in the US :???:

 

[Shaft]

Sandy,

You and your buddies can just sit by that window watching the hole in the screen while the flies inside lay their eggs and the maggots start crawling all over your families' food. Sounds right to me. Not.

Given that the prion is not in muscle tissue, and the US keeps grinding downers, I am absolutely grateful for COOL so I can buy the far safer Canadian cuts for my family. But you carry on, old boy.

OT, when the US blames Canada for its own mess down the road, it won't matter much to the consumers, as Canada will be certified BSE free by the OIE soon enough, just about the time the US problems ramp right up. Should suit you and OT just fine, Sandy. You two can scream and yell while US consumers are rushing to buy Canadian beef, and do your best to try and blame it on the Canucks as your own little Titanic goes down by the nose.

Meanwhile, last time I checked, R-CALF's lawyers were driving Mercedes and BMWs while the big three are dying. You boys just love your country, now don't you. Patriotism like that I can do without. I'd read you a little more Samuel Johnson, but as you didn't get it the first time, there seems little point. I'm done with you boys.

 

[burnt]

I will present one last analogy on this matter.

You think it will help to keep the flies out if you shut the doors and windows? Not so much since you have a huge pile of horse manure inside your house. And you know that said pile is breeding maggots and flies so fast you can't even see a fly come in an open window. That buzz you hear is not a swarm of honey bees! So every time you swat a fly Sandhusker, remember this analogy.

 

[RobertMac]

I'm done with you boys.

You make a post that blames the Canadian BSE cases on imported cattle from England.
You chastise Sandhusker for pointing out that we shouldn't make the same mistake that Canada did.
Whether we have two cases and covering up the rest or only have two cases, has little bearing on the importation of BSE.

 

[GLA]

Kato,

I asked one of my contacts in Canada to respond to your statement that everyone is going broke. Here is his comments:

As far as I can see none of that is true. Maybe an isolated incident, but
not in general by any means. For example, one guy
had a bred cow sale last week and averaged $1700 on 700 cows. Another
customer just bought 80 bred cows for $1500 average. Several people I
talked to earlier this week were very happy with their bred cow and bull
sales this fall.

Feeder calf prices are better today than they were the same time last year.

I'm at Agribition, the largest cattle show in Canada, and the attitude of
breeders seems good.

Feedlots have been very tight lately with the cost of gain margin and
futures with possible protectionism by the States.

 

[gcreekrch]

Kato,

I asked one of my contacts in Canada to respond to your statement that everyone is going broke. Here is his comments:

As far as I can see none of that is true. Maybe an isolated incident, but
not in general by any means. For example, one guy
had a bred cow sale last week and averaged $1700 on 700 cows. Another
customer just bought 80 bred cows for $1500 average. Several people I
talked to earlier this week were very happy with their bred cow and bull
sales this fall.

Feeder calf prices are better today than they were the same time last year.

I'm at Agribition, the largest cattle show in Canada, and the attitude of
breeders seems good.

Feedlots have been very tight lately with the cost of gain margin and
futures with possible protectionism by the States.

Purebred sales are a whole different fictional world!!!!!!

Nov 13 there were several dispersals of commercial cow herds at our local auction market.
A few bred heifers reached $900, the same as they were worth to go to a feedlot.
One set of 2 and 3 yr. olds brought $785
Most of the rest went to the kill plant for 35 to 43 cents depending on condition. I am guessing that maybe 25% of 900 head went to raise calves.

I haven't heard of anyone going broke here but folks are darn sure selling out before they spend any more.
I believe there are a lot that are teetering but I don't think the banks want a repeat of the 80's.

 

[Yanuck]

Kato,

I asked one of my contacts in Canada to respond to your statement that everyone is going broke. Here is his comments:

As far as I can see none of that is true. Maybe an isolated incident, but
not in general by any means. For example, one guy
had a bred cow sale last week and averaged $1700 on 700 cows. Another
customer just bought 80 bred cows for $1500 average. Several people I
talked to earlier this week were very happy with their bred cow and bull
sales this fall.

Feeder calf prices are better today than they were the same time last year.

I'm at Agribition, the largest cattle show in Canada, and the attitude of
breeders seems good.

Feedlots have been very tight lately with the cost of gain margin and
futures with possible protectionism by the States.

Purebred sales are a whole different fictional world!!!!!!

Nov 13 there were several dispersals of commercial cow herds at our local auction market.
A few bred heifers reached $900, the same as they were worth to go to a feedlot.
One set of 2 and 3 yr. olds brought $785
Most of the rest went to the kill plant for 35 to 43 cents depending on condition. I am guessing that maybe 25% of 900 head went to raise calves.

I haven't heard of anyone going broke here but folks are darn sure selling out before they spend any more.
I believe there are a lot that are teetering but I don't think the banks want a repeat of the 80's.

Innisfail Auction Mart

Steers Heifers
0-300 lb avg - 0-300 lb avg -
300-400 lb avg 1.10-1.23 300-400 lb avg 0.83-1.01
400-500 lb avg 1.00-1.21 400-500 lb avg 0.81-1.02
500-600 lb avg 1.01-1.18 500-600 lb avg 0.78-0.99
600-700 lb avg 0.90-1.10 600-700 lb avg 0.80-0.95
700-800 lb avg 0.92-1.02 700-800 lb avg 0.81-0.95
800-900 lb avg 0.90-1.02 800-900 lb avg 0.80-0.92
900-1000 lb avg 0.88-0.96 900-1000 lb avg 0.75-0.91
1000+ lb avg 0.88-0.94 1000+ lb avg 0.80-0.85

Feeder Cows Butcher Cows Bulls Bred Cows
0.40-0.55 0.28-0.45 0.42-0.67 $ 500.00-900.00

 

[hillsdown]

Innisfail Auction Mart

Steers Heifers
0-300 lb avg - 0-300 lb avg -
300-400 lb avg 1.10-1.23 300-400 lb avg 0.83-1.01
400-500 lb avg 1.00-1.21 400-500 lb avg 0.81-1.02
500-600 lb avg 1.01-1.18 500-600 lb avg 0.78-0.99
600-700 lb avg 0.90-1.10 600-700 lb avg 0.80-0.95
700-800 lb avg 0.92-1.02 700-800 lb avg 0.81-0.95
800-900 lb avg 0.90-1.02 800-900 lb avg 0.80-0.92
900-1000 lb avg 0.88-0.96 900-1000 lb avg 0.75-0.91
1000+ lb avg 0.88-0.94 1000+ lb avg 0.80-0.85

Feeder Cows Butcher Cows Bulls Bred Cows
0.40-0.55 0.28-0.45 0.42-0.67 $ 500.00-900.00

What week was this from ? I was there last Wed. and these are not the averages at all..Unless I missed something, the prices are wayyy off. Most of the 500-600lb steers were selling for 80-90 cents a pound and I don't think I saw a 400lb steer going for more than a 1.05/lb. As far as heifers well,,,it doesn't even pay for shipping. :roll:

Even the PB sales are down, there is a big dispersal being held in the next couple of week, the herd has quite a few AI calves and out of Dams of distinction/dams of merit cows..I will let you know what they bring..

 

[Yanuck]

Innisfail Auction Mart

Steers Heifers
0-300 lb avg - 0-300 lb avg -
300-400 lb avg 1.10-1.23 300-400 lb avg 0.83-1.01
400-500 lb avg 1.00-1.21 400-500 lb avg 0.81-1.02
500-600 lb avg 1.01-1.18 500-600 lb avg 0.78-0.99
600-700 lb avg 0.90-1.10 600-700 lb avg 0.80-0.95
700-800 lb avg 0.92-1.02 700-800 lb avg 0.81-0.95
800-900 lb avg 0.90-1.02 800-900 lb avg 0.80-0.92
900-1000 lb avg 0.88-0.96 900-1000 lb avg 0.75-0.91
1000+ lb avg 0.88-0.94 1000+ lb avg 0.80-0.85

Feeder Cows Butcher Cows Bulls Bred Cows
0.40-0.55 0.28-0.45 0.42-0.67 $ 500.00-900.00

What week was this from ? I was there last Wed. and these are not the averages at all..Unless I missed something, the prices are wayyy off. Most of the 500-600lb steers were selling for 80-90 cents a pound and I don't think I saw a 400lb steer going for more than a 1.05/lb. As far as heifers well,,,it doesn't even pay for shipping. :roll:

Even the PB sales are down, there is a big dispersal being held in the next couple of week, the herd has quite a few AI calves and out of Dams of distinction/dams of merit cows..I will let you know what they bring..

Week ending Wednesday, November 19, 2008
5952 HEAD for week
http://www.innisfailauctionmarket.com/market.asp

 

[burnt]

Kato,

I asked one of my contacts in Canada to respond to your statement that everyone is going broke. Here is his comments:

As far as I can see none of that is true. Maybe an isolated incident, but
not in general by any means. For example, one guy
had a bred cow sale last week and averaged $1700 on 700 cows. Another
customer just bought 80 bred cows for $1500 average. Several people I
talked to earlier this week were very happy with their bred cow and bull
sales this fall.

Feeder calf prices are better today than they were the same time last year.

I'm at Agribition, the largest cattle show in Canada, and the attitude of
breeders seems good.

Feedlots have been very tight lately with the cost of gain margin and
futures with possible protectionism by the States.

Wellllll, considering that he was telling it to a Texan he probably wanted it to sound good! But as far as the commercial picture is concerned his words are totally inaccurate.

 

[Kato]

GLA, to get a true picture, you've got to get out of the Agribition barns. It's not the real world. Here in Manitoba, the part of the province with the most cattle spent most of the summer under water, and the situation is actually best described as desperate. There are guys with herds of 400 cows getting jobs in town because they can't pay their bills. A lot are just around now out of pure stubbornness. They've dug in their heels.

There's even a joke going around that they need to make polygamy legal because just one wife working in town isn't enough to keep the farm going.

:roll: :roll: :roll: