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Why do ranch hands move so often?

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The property management group he uses out of Gordon seems to have a running ad in most of the ag. papers. Granted, they're probably hire for all of the ranches he has in NE, not just the one so. of Gordon, but it still makes you think they probably go through some help.

The company we're with had a cattle ranch at Ft. Pierre that Turner bought out. The manager there was offered the management job when Turner took over, but he passed on that and moved up to our ranch on Standing Rock, instead.

He said he just was not impressed with the proposed management practices.
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Then again, the company we're with is known for going through help on all of the places they own, too. And we've been here for 5 years and are perfectly happy. :wink:
 
The ranches around here that Turner has bought it seems to be the way they keep help is based more on the ranch manager. The one that i have friends on the help is very satisfied and have all been there pretty much since last August. However on one of the ranches closer to Gordon I've been told they are switching help a lot due to a real "jerk" for a manager. What Turner offers is a competative wage, insurance, every other weekend off, vacation, and sick time. Know any ranchers that offer that???
 
it seems to be the way they keep help is based more on the ranch manager.

That seems to be the way it is with our company, too.

What Turner offers is a competative wage, insurance, every other weekend off, vacation, and sick time.

No go on the insurance, but here the pay is quite good, the lesser half takes off whenever he wants/needs, gets two weeks worth of vacation, and the ranch'll let us run about as many horses as we'd like (a previous mgr was running about 20 broodmares at one point with no complaints, and they cover pasture/feed).

There are some good jobs out there, but there are definately a lot of frogs to kiss before you find them... :roll:
 
theHiredMansWife said:
There are some good jobs out there, but there are definately a lot of frogs to kiss before you find them... :roll:
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Just for the sake of fairness and the discussions sake, I'll bet there are a lot of ranchers and ranch managers who would say the same thing.

An argument I always had with my father in law, was based on him always cussing farmers and ranchers for getting all them tax cuts. I told him to go into debt to buy a business and lose money and he'd get them same tax cuts. He couldn't understand that when the company he was working for went broke, the feller who owned it lost his lifes savings and everything he'd put into that company. The father in law, lost a job and no money or life savings. All he had to take to the job was his skill. Everything else was provided for him by the business.

That isn't to say that there aren't companies who don't treat their employee's badly, but if it wasn't for the feller who was willing to take the chance and buy or keep a ranch, there would be no jobs for ranch hands and cowboys. It's kind of a two sided deal. :?
 
Yes I agree there is two sides to that coin. However I think the best bosses themselves at one time have worked for someone else and had to do jobs they didn't want to.

"but if it wasn't for the feller who was willing to take the chance and buy or keep a ranch, there would be no jobs for ranch hands and cowboys."

Ok and the bit about if there weren't fellers willing to take a chance and buy or keep a ranch going as a favor to ranch hands. That makes me laugh. :lol: Yes ranch hands want to be given what a lousy 1200 a month and a place to live in exchange for being at the beck and call of someone? I'm not saying this is every situation but here in the Sandhills of Nebraska it's a pretty normal job description with ranchers even going so far as to not provide beef. Oh and by the way,I'm not some bitter hands wife my Dad is the boss, just so ya all don't jump on that band wagon. However, I see the struggles of some of my friends.
 
CattleRMe said:
Yes I agree there is two sides to that coin. However I think the best bosses themselves at one time have worked for someone else and had to do jobs they didn't want to.

"but if it wasn't for the feller who was willing to take the chance and buy or keep a ranch, there would be no jobs for ranch hands and cowboys."

Ok and the bit about if there weren't fellers willing to take a chance and buy or keep a ranch going as a favor to ranch hands. That makes me laugh. :lol: Yes ranch hands want to be given what a lousy 1200 a month and a place to live in exchange for being at the beck and call of someone? I'm not saying this is every situation but here in the Sandhills of Nebraska it's a pretty normal job description with ranchers even going so far as to not provide beef. Oh and by the way,I'm not some bitter hands wife my Dad is the boss, just so ya all don't jump on that band wagon. However, I see the struggles of some of my friends.
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Around here there are lots of Town jobs that top pay is $10 an hour That's $1600 a month before taxes these people still need to pay rent buy ALL there food plus drive to work.There are low paying jobs all over and prick bosses in every field.I have had employees for the last 15 years in my welding shop I paid them $13 an hour no benefits and no BEEF on top of their wages it cost me another $8.00 an hour for workmans compensation and my share of their taxes.There were plenty of week's that the only people who made money were the hired help after I paid all the bills I needed to borrow money to eat on being the BOSS is'nt all it's cracked up to be. Before you all cuss the boss remember if you go to college and get a degree and work a job you hate you to will make BIG money. And quite possibly have a Prick boss there also.My wife worked as a waitress when we got married while raiseing babies working full time she attended college and is now a Registered Nurse but she had to work very hard for it.Now she has a very good job and benifits that she really likes.It should come as no suprise that Farm and Ranch jobs are lower paying the whole industry is lower paying but great living.There's more to life than the almighty dollar.Take it from someone who started with nothing where there's a will there's a way no excuses.
 
Bottom line for any employer. If your employee don't make you money, he's got to go.

Bottom line for any employee. If you don't make make your boss money, you won't be there long.
 
Ya know...I read a very interesting statistic last year concerning employment in the States....Nursing and teachers will have the biggest "needs" with well over 300,000 nurses needed to fill open positions!! Ranchers/farmers was DEAD LAST ( with an estimated half a million jobs being cut)!!!! :shock: Broke my heart! Many ranches and farms are going corporate and simply "downsizing" their help!! New modern technology and all.....a little scary when I think that all on this board could be a "dying breed" :cry: Maybe all of us who CHOSE this way of life better enjoy the freedoms it allows while we can!! Just a thought!! :wink:
 
Mike is on the right track.

Over the years I have had several employees and when I was a supervisor at "Western Electric" or a communications NCO in the Corp I have had several good ( make that GREAT) people working with me.

I have had several I had to fire for stealing, causing trouble with other employees, rude to customers, missing work.

If you have a good employee and you intend to stay in business you will help and cultivate them. But if you are going to stay in business you also need to rid yourself of problem employees ASAP.

As far as wages - - - I have found a good employee needs a fair wage but paying more does not make a better employee. I have always paid what I feel is a fair wage and at the firat of December I figure as best I can what proffit the operation is going to make for the year and 10% of that is devided among the employees as a Christmas bonus. To qualify for a bonus the employee earns one point for going a full week with out missing any time. They get two additional points for going a full month without missing any time so on a given monththey can earn 6 or 7 points max.

Then 80 % of the money available for bonuses is dived according to the points earned - - the other 20% buys a company dinner at a great place of the employees chosing and "special bonuses" are presented at that time for special things done that helped to the companies success. Always reward employees in public and make any needed issues private.

My employees fall into two catagories - - -some that last a couple of months ( or weeks) and those that lasted decades. Weed out the non producers as quickly as possible and show fairness at all times and you will be suprised how good the rest will become. Provide your employees with the training and tools they need and get out of their way. Don't ask anyone to do anything you have not done yourself.
 
It is my belief that a lot of the problems with cowboys could be avoided if no lies were told.
How would it be if a cowboy said 'yes, I can calve out your cows' and couldn't? He'd be sent down the road pretty fast.
But when a boss or owner tells someone during an interview, 'we'll fix this or that in the house' but doesn't, (or give days off, or wants you to farm when he said he wouldn't) the cowboy is STILL the one that goes down the road.
Then of course there are just those that get someplace figured out and want to see the next place. I love those guys, live with just a bedroll, a truck and trailer, maybe a dog and a couple a good horses, just like it was 125 years ago (except that truck and trailer thing)
Remember in the movie Cheyenne Social Club when Jimmy Stewart asks Glen Ford 'Ain't you gonna give any notice?' and Glenn Ford replies, "I gave them that when I signed on."
 
Mike said:
Bottom line for any employer. If your employee don't make you money, he's got to go.

Bottom line for any employee. If you don't make make your boss money, you won't be there long.
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Thats simple enough.Ilike it
 
Lots of common sence happening in this thread (what's going on :lol: )

Denny's point about payroll taxes and workers comp is a great one. Most workers in any business don't think about those costs.

A lot of hands wonder why the boss isn't doing the grunt work or some of it...who did it before the hand was hired? Many times the boss worked hard and is forced to hire help because of declining health or just because he can finally afford to.

A mid sized feedlot/farming cow/calf place up here had to sell off a bunch of cows because they couldn't find help to calve them out. $2000 a month plus a house wouldn't hold anyone. Granted, I only know the guys in passing, but they seem decent. Most people just don't want the 6 weeks of round the clock calving they need done.(no feeding or other stuff, just calve)

My wife switched jobs and saw her old boss yesterday. He wants her back and asked what she is making now. ($2.38 more than he was paying her). He said he can't justify it, so he still is looking for help.
 
Worker's comp for welders in MN 36% of total wages and you surely don't want any claims.So if anyone ever got hurt I would pay their bill in full.Worker's comp Legalized exstortion.
 
Denny is right about Workman's Comp. We had an issue with it when our son-in-law was injured (totally handicapped) in 1988. We sued them, but you can't beat 'em and they paid not a dime.

Another fellow here was injured on the job, almost lost his leg and what Workman's Comp has put them through is just terrible. What he got in the end didn't amount to much.

I have no use for Workmans Comp. It is a rip-off bureaucracy.
 
Jason said:
Lots of common sence happening in this thread (what's going on :lol: )

Denny's point about payroll taxes and workers comp is a great one. Most workers in any business don't think about those costs.

A lot of hands wonder why the boss isn't doing the grunt work or some of it...who did it before the hand was hired? Many times the boss worked hard and is forced to hire help because of declining health or just because he can finally afford to.

A mid sized feedlot/farming cow/calf place up here had to sell off a bunch of cows because they couldn't find help to calve them out. $2000 a month plus a house wouldn't hold anyone. Granted, I only know the guys in passing, but they seem decent. Most people just don't want the 6 weeks of round the clock calving they need done.(no feeding or other stuff, just calve)

My wife switched jobs and saw her old boss yesterday. He wants her back and asked what she is making now. ($2.38 more than he was paying her). He said he can't justify it, so he still is looking for help.
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My guess is that if he can not aford an extra $15 a day for a good and reliable employ he should not be in buisness!!!!!!!! If a good employ can not make that amount of money a day or more, he is already out of buisness but is just not smart enough to know it :shock:
 
Bottom line why do ranch employers so often expect help to live in situations they themselves would not live in?

Come on guys step out of your $40,000 pickups and tell me you can't afford it.
 
To be fair, most of the ranches we've been on, the housing was quite good and the wages were usually above average. (Then again, we've never been able to afford to take a job that paid "average" wages.)

Though there was the job north of Whitman/south of Merriman where we lived in this little 30'x30' box with the west wall knocked out where a trailer house had been attached. The whole thing was painted lime green and glowed in the moonlight.
The really bad part was that one of the guys' dogs had gotten locked in there for about a week shortly before we moved in (but after we'd looked at the job!). She was fine, but the house reeked.

Owner's wife couldn't figure out why we'd want a Rug Doctor. :roll:

The last house I had was this beautiful 2 story 1910 era house with the thick moldings, fireplace, etc. New carpet and paint throughout and an almost finished basement.

The perfect job would be where we're at now... with that house moved down here. :)
 
sounds to me too many people are looking over the fence thinking its better on the other side. do you realize what it costs to run an operation? Do you know what your house and utililities are costing your employer? If you agreed to work for so much a month are you to good to do what is asked of you whether it is horseback or in the tractor? If you don't want to do it then who does? When I worked for other people I always tried to go above and beyond what was asked of me and tried to treat the place like it was mine and how I would like it taken care of.That is why they hired you to help them do the things that they couldn't get done, so help them keep in business and keep your job.
Instead of complaining maybe look at how good you really have it and work a little harder and help the people you hired on to help. In my own situation now I have been away from this place for two days once in three years and that was to move my father in law back to North Dakota. I'm not complaining as I put myself in this situation but the help I hire all seem to want the paycheck and time off without working for it. They all want to be cowboys instead of ranchhands.
They act like getting in the tractor or irrigating is demeaning to them somehow. I've been calving bout five hundred cows and farming/haying 1400 acres by myself I hire people to help me but nobody seems to want to work that hard all they want is a paycheck and time off. What happened to taking care of the guys who take care of you?
I try to give the guys who work for me saturday afternoon and Sundays off except during haying and just suck it up and take care of their duties myself. But my family suffers and they miss me too but to keep things going I have to take care of everything my employee can't or aren't willing to do and every dollar is a big thing. I have been in management a long time and still didn't realize the amount of paperwork and phone time it takes to run a place this size. ON top of that I have 600 acres offlood irrigation and 2 pivots to keep going as well as fence to fix and cows to check and machinery to keep in good working condition and then have someone you hire tell me well I don't do that I only want to cowboy. Don't we all :!: So instead of cutting down the guy your working for try to put yourself in his shoes and tell him or her thank you for the opportunity to work for them. They wouldn't have hired you if they could do everything themselves. Every day I try to tell the guy who is working for me thanks for the days work and let him know that I appreciate everything he has done. While I know not everybody does thi but everybody I ever worked for in some way found a way to tell me that through actions or words.Maybe I was fortunate in the guys I worked for or maybe it was the positive attitude and never complaining no matter what job I was given. When you show up to work tomorrow tell whoever your working for thanks and if you aren't able to do that then you should be looking for a different job.
 

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