Cattle trade may resume soon

[Mike]

Stealth?...can't be detected...absolute and fruit juice taste like fruit juice...that is until the next morning :gag:

That's why my mouth tasted like a covey of quail roosted in it this morning! :lol:

 

[Anonymous]

RM: "Don't most nations have government mandated country of origin labeling laws???

The same types of labeling laws that that the U.S. has that deal with foreign trade.

That is not the same as the fatally flawed "M"COOL joke.

RM: "Why have they stopped marketing branded beef products?"

They haven't!

Where have you been?

Branded beef programs are increasing, not decreasing.

RM: "Thomas E. Wilson ring a bell??????"

Thomas E. Wilson was ibp's brand name.

SINCE TYSON BOUGHT OUT IBP DOES THEY TYSON BRAND NAME RING A BELL????

RM: "Why not sell CAB when someone else is doing your marketing for you?"

Tyson, Excel and Swift are middlemen. Doesn't matter who pays for advertising CAB if it brings more money, they pay more money for fat cattle.

RM: "Why not sell Canadian beef as perceived USA when some one else is doing the marketing for you...USA producers through the check-off?"

I wish they would market Canadian beef as it's own branded product. Then the Canadians could tamp your "perceived" trade barrier up your import blaming ars and you could pay for it. Unfortunately, the producers that can see world trade past the word "import" would also pay for your ignorance.

RM: "Which would help packer margins the most...continue to buy cheap Canadian cattle or reduce the price of USA live cattle?"

Obviously to keep all their plants at capacity instead of having too many cattle in Canada and not enough in the North Eastern plants.

RM: "What is the surest way to reduce the price of USA live cattle? Increase the supply of fat cattle."

Once again you have exposed your ignorance to the world.

What is the surest way to reduce the price of USA live cattle?

DECREASING CONSUMER DEMAND

INCREASING U.S. BEEF PRODUCTION WHICH MAY OR MAY NOT BE RELATED TO AN INCREASE IN FAT CATTLE

DECREASING EXPORT DEMAND


Why you insist on showing others how much you don't know about these issues will continue to amaze me.

RM: "Why do I have to contradict what you thought I said when you didn't understand what it was I said?"

I understood what you said but you certainly didn't!



~SH~

 

[agman]

BRM, the thing I don't like about HACCP is that it moves the inspector farther from the actual process of inspecting and puts him more as a monitor of the HACCP plan. Positive corrective measures were taken with the increase in E. coli testing by inspectors instead of relying on test results from the plants.

You are wrong with that assesment RM.

 

[Bill]

They may seem the same to Canadians,but I believe the differnces are obvious,add the fact it is minus country of orgin and you can see why some are upset.....................good luck

OK Haymensa since you are up on HACCP tell us what the differences between Canada and the US are :roll:

You know what the differnces are,as well as I and I dont have time to try to educate an ole lieing canuckle head this morning ,I been putting off some chores in south TX about as long as I can,Im sure you canuckle heads will miss me this week :wink: ............good luck PS label it!!!!!!!

Once again the Haymaker doesn't know how to support his lie so he runs and hides. :shock: :lol: :lol:

 

[Sandhusker]

SH, "Tyson, Excel and Swift are middlemen. Doesn't matter who pays for advertising CAB if it brings more money, they pay more money for fat cattle. "

Hmmmm, here I thought they, like any other business, would try to pay as little as they could for raw materials. :shock: Maybe you could tell us the formula they use on determining the price they pay from the price they get?

 

[RobertMac]

BRM, the thing I don't like about HACCP is that it moves the inspector farther from the actual process of inspecting and puts him more as a monitor of the HACCP plan. Positive corrective measures were taken with the increase in E. coli testing by inspectors instead of relying on test results from the plants.

You are wrong with that assesment RM.

Agman, I hope I am, but that is how a FSIS inspector explained it to me. More hands on involvement and more inspectors would be good for the industry and publicity of this would increase consumer confidence.

 

[RobertMac]

SH: "The same types of labeling laws that that the U.S. has that deal with foreign trade."

Then why isn't all imported beef labeled to the consumer???

RM: "What is the surest way to reduce the price of USA live cattle? Increase the supply of fat cattle."

SH: "What is the surest way to reduce the price of USA live cattle?

DECREASING CONSUMER DEMAND

DECREASING EXPORT DEMAND "

And what is the surest way to manipulate consumer demand???

SH: "INCREASING U.S. BEEF PRODUCTION WHICH MAY OR MAY NOT BE RELATED TO AN INCREASE IN FAT CATTLE "

Increasing fat cattle supply will increase in beef production and if usage doesn't increase equivalently, live cattle prices will go down. Cow/calf producers should think about supporting an organization that is working in this direction!!!!

 

[Beefman]

SH to Sandhusker: "Tyson, Excel and Swift are middlemen. Doesn't matter who pays for advertising CAB if it brings more money, they pay more money for fat cattle. "

(Sandhusker in reply) "Hmmmm, here I thought they, like any other business, would try to pay as little as they could for raw materials. Maybe you could tell us the formula they use on determining the price they pay from the price they get?"

Over the past 10 years, every processor mentioned above, plus several others have paid carcass premiums for prime, choice, cab, etc. Also, most have in house branding programs which they pay premiums on. Real simple, they get more in the marketplace, so they pay more for the cattle.

You also have options to educate yourself on formulas for determining prices paid in relation to current market factors. NCBA has educational seminars at convention dealing with such issues. Also, TX A&M, OK State, and your very own Neb have 2-3 day short courses where you take live cattle to retail cuts. Pricing issues are fully discussed. It'd be well worth your time to investigate, and you'd be able to answer the questions you posed.

Beefman

 

[Sandhusker]

SH to Sandhusker: "Tyson, Excel and Swift are middlemen. Doesn't matter who pays for advertising CAB if it brings more money, they pay more money for fat cattle. "

(Sandhusker in reply) "Hmmmm, here I thought they, like any other business, would try to pay as little as they could for raw materials. Maybe you could tell us the formula they use on determining the price they pay from the price they get?"

Over the past 10 years, every processor mentioned above, plus several others have paid carcass premiums for prime, choice, cab, etc. Also, most have in house branding programs which they pay premiums on. Real simple, they get more in the marketplace, so they pay more for the cattle.

You also have options to educate yourself on formulas for determining prices paid in relation to current market factors. NCBA has educational seminars at convention dealing with such issues. Also, TX A&M, OK State, and your very own Neb have 2-3 day short courses where you take live cattle to retail cuts. Pricing issues are fully discussed. It'd be well worth your time to investigate, and you'd be able to answer the questions you posed.

Beefman

Beefman, I think I need a disclosure that every time I ask SH a question doesn't mean that I don't know the answer. :lol: I was just trying to pick a fight - in his blanket defence of the packers, he always tries to tell us there is a link between their general profitability and fats prices.

 

[Anonymous]

RM: "Then why isn't all imported beef labeled to the consumer???"

Because consumers aren't asking for it. It's only an issue with trade isolationists that cannot see trade past the word "import".

RM: "Increasing fat cattle supply will increase in beef production and if usage doesn't increase equivalently, live cattle prices will go down. Cow/calf producers should think about supporting an organization that is working in this direction!!!!"

Increasing fat cattle supply will increase production IF CARCASS SIZE REMAINS THE SAME. A decrease in cattle numbers can be washed out by a corresponding increase in carcass weights.

You import blamers always forget that pork and poultry are our primary competition, not live cattle imports.

Our fat cattle prices would be higher if we had normal export markets. Producers should think about supporting an organization that looks for trade opportunities and wants to normalize trade rather than an organization that can't see past the word "import" and is willing to give up an additional $40 per head by supporting an end to trade.

Producers should think about supporting an organization that doesn't lie about the safety of Canadian beef to stop Canadian imports and then act like we have taken different BSE precautionary measures than Canada.

I don't know who R-CULT thinks they represent but it certainly isn't the forward thinking, non blaming segment of our industry.

Sandman: "Hmmmm, here I thought they, like any other business, would try to pay as little as they could for raw materials. Maybe you could tell us the formula they use on determining the price they pay from the price they get?"

The formula is rather simple. Beef and beef by products sell for a certain amount of money. It costs so much to process an animal. To that they add a small per head profit. That determines what they can pay for live cattle. What they have to pay is determined by what their competition is willing to pay.

How elementary!

If CAB brings more, the packers pay accordingly.

Sandman: "Beefman, I think I need a disclosure that every time I ask SH a question doesn't mean that I don't know the answer."

Yeh right!


~SH~

 

[Silver]

The ironic part of the whole thing is that the border is not really closed, we still export the beef. I have a hard time understanding what makes the risks lower if the meat is dead when it gets there rather than still walking. What kind of message does that send?
In any case, I hope the border stays open in it's present form only. If at some point the US would like to import certain cuts from older cattle so be it, but I think live cattle trade should be a thing of the past.

Try telling that to a cow-calf producer. They are getting ripped off by the packers and the government refuses to make the hard decisions.

I am a cow-calf producer. For the first time in a long time I see slaughter capacity growing in Canada, and Canadian industry repositioning itself to be a real global competitor. I realize most of this packing growth is by the 'evil american multinationals', but at least Canadian beef is getting cut in Canada. I'm reasonably optomistic that as time goes on things will only get better for us if we continue down this path.

 

[redriver]

silver,
So you have no problem with the fact that we have an oversupply of feeder calves which will continue to depress their value, while the US packers in Alberta are making 3 times as much profit as they were pre-bse?
It's ok with you that the packers make $240/head profit while the cow-calf producer makes nothing?
You may be a cow-calf producer, but you obviously don't know how to do books.
You're ok with the border situation staying as is. What about when r-calf and their crooked judge closes the border to boxed beef? If you think it won't happen, then you don't realise how the US "system" works. Cebull is going to close the border, and the USDA will have to appeal that "ruling" as well. We are going to be in big, big trouble. Our so-called government is going to have some kind of emergency bailout available when it happens, but we don't need another paltry handout, we need the government to quit accepting bribes from the packing industry and start going after export markets. If we don't break our dependancy on the crooks to our south, we're screwed.[/b]

 

[Silver]

silver,
So you have no problem with the fact that we have an oversupply of feeder calves which will continue to depress their value, while the US packers in Alberta are making 3 times as much profit as they were pre-bse?
It's ok with you that the packers make $240/head profit while the cow-calf producer makes nothing?
You may be a cow-calf producer, but you obviously don't know how to do books.
You're ok with the border situation staying as is. What about when r-calf and their crooked judge closes the border to boxed beef? If you think it won't happen, then you don't realise how the US "system" works. Cebull is going to close the border, and the USDA will have to appeal that "ruling" as well. We are going to be in big, big trouble. Our so-called government is going to have some kind of emergency bailout available when it happens, but we don't need another paltry handout, we need the government to quit accepting bribes from the packing industry and start going after export markets. If we don't break our dependancy on the crooks to our south, we're screwed.[/b]

Redriver.... I know a little bit about the books, thanks for your concern. R-calf and the boxed beef issue is a whole other deal.
It's not just oversupply of feeder calves, cull cows are a big problem also. Nothing about the current situation is pleasant,everyone can agree on that I'm sure. My point is simply that while this hurts like hell, I feel it is in our long term best interests to not export live cattle. Would you like to see zero federally inspected slaughter houses in Canada?
Packers making huge profits on the backs of drowning producers is a problem unrelated to border closures and is a problem that needs to be adressed on both sides of the border.

 

[Jessie]

Silver... I have read and reread your posts and truth be told, the comment about the border staying closed being a good option... sorry qoute not word for word.....Any whos thought uh hello r ya there.
I have now reread them and am thinking the meaning is Canadain cattle men and women should not put all their eggs into one basket again?
Is this correct.

 

[Mike]

silver,
So you have no problem with the fact that we have an oversupply of feeder calves which will continue to depress their value, while the US packers in Alberta are making 3 times as much profit as they were pre-bse?
It's ok with you that the packers make $240/head profit while the cow-calf producer makes nothing?
You may be a cow-calf producer, but you obviously don't know how to do books.
You're ok with the border situation staying as is. What about when r-calf and their crooked judge closes the border to boxed beef? If you think it won't happen, then you don't realise how the US "system" works. Cebull is going to close the border, and the USDA will have to appeal that "ruling" as well. We are going to be in big, big trouble. Our so-called government is going to have some kind of emergency bailout available when it happens, but we don't need another paltry handout, we need the government to quit accepting bribes from the packing industry and start going after export markets. If we don't break our dependancy on the crooks to our south, we're screwed.[/b]

Red, Your statement about your government "accepting bribes from the packing industry" and then turning around and calling those to south "crooks" tells me a lot about your character, or lack of.
Furthurmore, " breaking your dependency "southward" is exactly what Silver was trying to communicate!
Your hatred and inability to comprehend is boring to say the least!
Your Friend in the "South". :wink:

 

[RobertMac]

SH, every country has the right to mark imports by country of origin(including live cattle) and have the country of origin identified to the consumer. In every poll of USA consumers, the vast majority want to know country of origin of their food.

Then why isn't all imported beef labeled to the consumer???


Formula pricing and price differentiation between prime and standard does not establish live cattle market prices...supply vs. demand does...and buyers always buy as cheap as possible.

 

[redriver]

Mike rancher,
Spoken like a true inbred southerner. I don't really hate americans, just their attitude that they can do anything they please, rip off their friends, lie to get agreements then break those agreements, kill innocent people in other countries to steal their resources, etc. etc. Do you ever wonder why the world hates americans so much? Maybe it's because you are such assholes.

 

[Tommy]

redriver... Do you ever wonder why the world hates americans so much? Maybe it's because you are such assholes.

Then why in the hell is every country in the world trying get into our market if we are such assholes? You paint with a wide brush redriver.

 

[Jessie]

Red......I understand your frustration and anger.
But I refuse to believe or think that all people from the US are a$$holes.
Not being an A$$ here just you are sounding really angry and that distorts
ones thinking.

 

[Jessie]

I meant that anger makes one think irrational and then actions follow. Which doesn't accomplish any good.
I always know what I mean.... :?