Surprising answer!

[Soapweed]

It is nice to be able to sell our "black" cattle "on the hoof" to willing buyers without us having to own them through beef processing channels. If it is at least half Angus, meets the carcass qualifications, and most of all tastes good, it can be Certified Angus Beef. The advertising works, and I am betting there are very few dissatisfied customers when the ultimate taste test has been performed. Consumers have name recognition when it comes to Certified Angus Beef. If they didn't like it, they wouldn't be back. My hat is off to wherever dreamed up the concept. :tiphat:

 

[leanin' H]

It does HAVE to be atleast HALF Angus! You guys that are hollering that it's false or misleading....... Do you sell 100% Galloway or Charolais or Hereford? If not then how do you market it? Nobody is implying or garuanteeing 100% Angus beef. Everybody can get the information defining what CAB is and what it takes to qualify. There isnt some big conspiracy to mislead anyone. It is simply a way to sell beef. Which, when ya think about it, helps the folks who raise beef. Pure Country, if you sell a 3/4 galloway + 1/4 Highland how do you market it? As great tasting, all natural, grass fat beef right! Would you lose a sale to a client if they discovered their steak had 1/32 Simmetal in it's pedigree? Not unless you made a gaurantee that it was 100%, without a doubt Galloway or what have you. Nobody selling CAB makes any such gaurantee. You may say they imply that or wink, wink, folks into thinking thats what it is, but the facts state otherwise. CAB is 50% Angus Minimum, meets grade requirements and a great tool to sell beef. My two cents! Send me some Highland Steaks so I can see what I've been missing! :wink:

 

[Soapweed]

What is Certified Angus Beef ® (CAB) product?
The Certified Angus Beef ® brand is reserved for Angus beef that, after meeting the live specification of being at least 51% black-hided or AngusSource® enrolled, is verified by the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) as meeting the ten CAB carcass specifications:

1. Modest or higher marbling
2. Medium or fine marbling texture
3. "A" maturity for each, lean and skeletal characteristics
4. 10 to 16 square inch ribeye area
5. Less than 1,000 pound hot carcass weight
6. Less than 1 inch fat thickness
7. Superior muscling (restricts dairy influence)
8. Practically free of capillary rupture
9. No dark cutters
10. No neck hump exceeding 2 inches

 

[mwj]

What is Certified Angus Beef ® (CAB) product?
The Certified Angus Beef ® brand is reserved for Angus beef that, after meeting the live specification of being at least 51% black-hided or AngusSource® enrolled, is verified by the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) as meeting the ten CAB carcass specifications:

1. Modest or higher marbling
2. Medium or fine marbling texture
3. "A" maturity for each, lean and skeletal characteristics
4. 10 to 16 square inch ribeye area
5. Less than 1,000 pound hot carcass weight
6. Less than 1 inch fat thickness
7. Superior muscling (restricts dairy influence)
8. Practically free of capillary rupture
9. No dark cutters
10. No neck hump exceeding 2 inches

51% black hide can be 1% Angus and still qualify if it meets the other specs.

 

[lazy ace]

To be cab all you have to have is a angus registred daddy right? So you could breed your angus bull to anything and go
CAB... Correct me if I'm wrong...

If it meets carcass specs I think. :?

Soooooo H, You got a goat..... I've got a registered bull... Suppose we could go CAB??? What's the carcass specs on that goat??? All the bull pimps say my bull is the best since apple pie.... :twisted: :twisted: :lol2: :roll:

Katrina you have nailed it CAB stands for Certified Angus Billy. :lol: :lol: :lol: now lets corner the market and make some real doe.

:wink: :wink:

I am not sure if the angus people are propping up the rest of the industry or the rest of the industry is propping up the angus.

I kind of like CHB myself just harder to find.

have a good one

lazy ace

 

[Denny]

Here's a novel Idea lets all bash CAB and see if we can't drive some beef demand down. I think on this subject we all would be better served to acknowledge a fine product and marketing plan that thru it's success has driven beef demand higher. Which creates demand for all type's of beef weather it be kill cows dairy beef or any other mix or cross bred. Certified hereford beef requirements from their website.

CHB Program Specifications and Requirements
At Certified Hereford Beef® we are committed to the quality, the consistency, and the integrity of our product. We use only the very best Hereford and Hereford influenced Cattle available on the market today. We believe that our dedication to using only quality bred cattle has directly influenced the success we have had and will continue to have for years to come. The result is a consistently satisfying and economically priced product our retail and foodservice outlets are proud to provide to their customers; and in the end, a product our producers are proud to deliver.

Thanks for your support of this program.

Certified Hereford Beef® Live Animal Specifications
Cattle must have a predominately (51%) white face and exhibit white markings over the jaw, forehead and muzzle. White markings on any part of the hip, shoulder, or side of the body such as spots, stripes, or belts are not acceptable.
Acceptable cattle are offered for qualification expect those other than solid red, solid black or roan with a predominately white face, such as yellow, gray, brown, brindle, or smoke are ineligible.
Only steers and heifers of English beef type breeding under 30 months of age – an animal expressing dairy or Bos indicus type breeding are not acceptable.
To qualify, cattle may be either horned or polled. Bulls, bullocks, or cows are not acceptable.
Certified Hereford Beef® Carcass Specifications


Slight 00 to Moderate 99 Marbling Score
Yield Grade 4 and leaner
600 – 1,000 lbs carcass weight
NO DARK CUTTERS
A maturity only
Who determines Certified Hereford Beef® eligibility?
All eligible cattle and carcasses are certified by the United States Department of Agriculture (USDA) at program approved harvest facilities. Live animals are evaluated for confirmation to CHB visual specifications for hide color and other indicators. Each carcass is individually certified by USDA graders. Both live animal and carcass specifications are determined by Certified Hereford Beef® LLC and posted to the USDA website at UDSA.gov.

 

[Soapweed]

When you go into a restaurant which advertises that they serve only Certified Angus Beef, you are pretty likely to have a great cut of beef. My guess is there would even be somewhat of guarantee to this effect. If the meat wasn't just pretty darned good, and you complained with justification, I'll bet heads would roll somewhere. To consumers, a CAB label means consistent quality and great taste.

On the other hand, if a restaurant proclaimed that they serve only "beef born, raised, and processed in the USA," that wouldn't mean very much. Meat with this label could be anything from Yak, to Brahman, to who knows what--grain fed, grass fed, to fed on chicken droppings.

Certified Angus Beef is good stuff, whether you participate in the program or not,

 

[cowhunter]

So, if I put a angus bull on my crackers, I'm not the red headed step child anymore? Not! I'll keep my old beefy lookin cracker bulls and some black hair die when I'm in need of the market. And even give them a dose of ral grow for good measure so as not to gouge the poor man next in line. Lol.

 

[jigs]

I know a guy selling Charlois as CAB....meat meats the specs and they look the other way on the hide. do I see an advantage of higher prices? sure, but the black hide bias at the barn is a crock. but I take joy knowing that most black cow guys in my area are breeding to Hereford bulls cause that is the way they get the growth and marbling to make a decent steak....

 

[ANGUS327]

So, if you don't know this, how can you say with
certainty that it is false advertising?

At the risk of repeating myself, the WHOLE system, campaign, advertising scheme - all of it, is "FALSE" because there is absolutely no guarantee that you are getting Angus beef.

To illustrate my argument FH let's take my ranch for example. We run 200 head around here that are anything from purebred Galloway, purebred Highland, purebred Angus to a wide variety of crosses. We feed no grain to anything, and all of our fat cattle are finished solely on grass. Thus, our advertising states that our beef is 100% GRASS FINISHED and ALL-NATURAL. No hormones, no antibiotics and no vaccinations.

That's our campaign in a nutshell. AT NO POINT, in our advertising or marketing did it ever cross our minds to call it Certified Galloway Beef, on the premise that it's MOST LIKELY GALLOWAY, since 75% of our herd is purebred or halfblood Galloway.

Sure you could call it Galloway beef but nobody would know what the @#% you were talking about

 

[High Plains]

Suppose I'll throw in a point or two here...

When CAB was created in the 70's (?) there was pretty much one black-hided breed. Can you guess the name? Hence, the black-hide requirement pretty much guaranteed Angus at that time. Since then many other breeds have gone black to follow the market that was created for black Angus. So the hide color thing doesn't work quite so well anymore.

Next, I think only about 15% of the 51% black-hided cattle make it past the carcass specs for CAB. So, it sure doesn't look like just a black-hide deal and you get a rubber-stamp on that critter.

Finally, if there weren't some Angus blood in a lot of those 51% black-hided cattle that go into CAB, then I bet there also wouldn't be very many of them meeting the carcass marbling that is needed. Likely a bit of Angus in those crossbreds, don't you guess?

Jigs, I'm sorry, but I have to call you on that statement about Hereford adding the marbling to the Angus cows for your neighboring ranchers. Maybe some Hereford bulls will do so, no doubt, but as a breed I don't think that Herefords are upping the marbling ante on Angus. Yes, the Hereford cross is sure a good one and likely some benefits above straight Angus in many cases.

If I'm betting my dining budget on a good meal, I'll bet on a CAB steak every time. Chances are just way better that I'll get the kind of steak I am looking for. So what's in a name? There are specs there that help me hedge my bet.

HP

 

[Grassfarmer]

I'm actually a lot less concerned about the meat aspect - whether it came from something wearing a black, red or white coat as long as the quality is there.
I have a bigger problem with the genetic side - "breeds" pretending to be something they are not as I think that will cause more problems in the long run.
Actually in my beef retailing business we are short on cattle this year - now we calf later it's tougher to get them finished off grass before the second winter. We usually use all our early born steers but last year we had a run of heifer calves born first which we will use as replacements. So we are supplementing our beef supply by purchasing a few head from a known source that rears to the same protocol as us. We are really having to drop our standards though - no longer will our beeves be all red, some won't even have the usual minimum 50% Luing blood :shock: :shock: Yep we've had to stoop to buying some black "Angus" feeders :shock: :shock: :wink: :wink: :lol:

 

[leanin' H]

I'm actually a lot less concerned about the meat aspect - whether it came from something wearing a black, red or white coat as long as the quality is there.
I have a bigger problem with the genetic side - "breeds" pretending to be something they are not as I think that will cause more problems in the long run.
Actually in my beef retailing business we are short on cattle this year - now we calf later it's tougher to get them finished off grass before the second winter. We usually use all our early born steers but last year we had a run of heifer calves born first which we will use as replacements. So we are supplementing our beef supply by purchasing a few head from a known source that rears to the same protocol as us. We are really having to drop our standards though - no longer will our beeves be all red, some won't even have the usual minimum 50% Luing blood :shock: :shock: Yep we've had to stoop to buying some black "Angus" feeders :shock: :shock: :wink: :wink: :lol:

Watch as Grassfarmers beef buisness really takes off now that he's selling great beef! :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :wink:

 

[Dylan Biggs]

It does HAVE to be atleast HALF Angus! You guys that are hollering that it's false or misleading....... Do you sell 100% Galloway or Charolais or Hereford? If not then how do you market it? Nobody is implying or garuanteeing 100% Angus beef. Everybody can get the information defining what CAB is and what it takes to qualify. There isnt some big conspiracy to mislead anyone. It is simply a way to sell beef. Which, when ya think about it, helps the folks who raise beef. Pure Country, if you sell a 3/4 galloway + 1/4 Highland how do you market it? As great tasting, all natural, grass fat beef right! Would you lose a sale to a client if they discovered their steak had 1/32 Simmetal in it's pedigree? Not unless you made a gaurantee that it was 100%, without a doubt Galloway or what have you. Nobody selling CAB makes any such gaurantee. You may say they imply that or wink, wink, folks into thinking thats what it is, but the facts state otherwise. CAB is 50% Angus Minimum, meets grade requirements and a great tool to sell beef. My two cents! Send me some Highland Steaks so I can see what I've been missing! :wink:

You are right it has been a great marketing campaign. From what I have been able to determine there are no requirements for CAB to actually contain any Angus blood. Thats why I titled the post Surprised. When I was told by the chief grader at the lakeside plant at Brooks which was owned by IBP at the time, that for him to qualify a carcass for CAB the "only" requirements were that the animal was at least 51% black hide and met the carcass specs. Thats it. It could be a black Holstein and as long as it graded it could qualify. I still find this hard to believe. Someone any one give me a credible referenced source or CAB spec that proves this wrong. I would be happy to be proved wrong.

 

[Big Muddy rancher]

The American Angus Association set up the "Certified Angus Beef" brand in 1978. The goal of this brand was to promote the idea that Angus beef was of higher quality than beef from other breeds of cattle. Cattle are eligible for "Certified Angus Beef" evaluation if they are at least 51% black and exhibit Angus influence, which include Black Simmental beef and crossbreds. However, they must meet all 10 of the following criteria, which were refined in January 2007 to further enhance product consistency, to be labeled "Certified Angus Beef" by USDA Graders:[16]

* Modest or higher degree of marbling
* Medium or fine marbling texture
* "A" maturity
* 10 to 16-square-inch ribeye area
* Less than 1,000-pound hot carcase weight
* Less than 1-inch fat thickness
* Moderately thick or thicker muscling
* No hump on the neck exceeding 5 cm (2 inches)
* Practically free of capillary rupture
* No dark cutting characteristics

 

[leanin' H]

It does HAVE to be atleast HALF Angus! You guys that are hollering that it's false or misleading....... Do you sell 100% Galloway or Charolais or Hereford? If not then how do you market it? Nobody is implying or garuanteeing 100% Angus beef. Everybody can get the information defining what CAB is and what it takes to qualify. There isnt some big conspiracy to mislead anyone. It is simply a way to sell beef. Which, when ya think about it, helps the folks who raise beef. Pure Country, if you sell a 3/4 galloway + 1/4 Highland how do you market it? As great tasting, all natural, grass fat beef right! Would you lose a sale to a client if they discovered their steak had 1/32 Simmetal in it's pedigree? Not unless you made a gaurantee that it was 100%, without a doubt Galloway or what have you. Nobody selling CAB makes any such gaurantee. You may say they imply that or wink, wink, folks into thinking thats what it is, but the facts state otherwise. CAB is 50% Angus Minimum, meets grade requirements and a great tool to sell beef. My two cents! Send me some Highland Steaks so I can see what I've been missing! :wink:

You are right it has been a great marketing campaign. From what I have been able to determine there are no requirements for CAB to actually contain any Angus blood. Thats why I titled the post Surprised. When I was told by the chief grader at the lakeside plant at Brooks which was owned by IBP at the time, that for him to qualify a carcass for CAB the "only" requirements were that the animal was at least 51% black hide and met the carcass specs. Thats it. It could be a black Holstein and as long as it graded it could qualify. I still find this hard to believe. Someone any one give me a credible referenced source or CAB spec that proves this wrong. I would be happy to be proved wrong.

My Bad!! You have to have atleast 50% Angus to qualify for the Angus Source program. Sorry for crossing my wires! :roll:

 

[gcreekrch]

Although I have never used them, I thought this was what the Certified Angus tags were for. Ridiculous that producers are paying the Angus Assn. premium prices for eartags and any black hided animal qualifies.

I've got a few black ewes, do their lambs qualify also?

IMHO, this is just another example of how assn's are doing their job for the processor and retailer's benefit. :roll:

 

[Faster horses]

Generations of America's farmers and ranchers do the selecting, raising and feeding so our licensed restaurant and grocery store partners can offer the very best beef available – the Certified Angus Beef ® brand. It's so good, less than 8% of all beef makes the grade.

Their commitment to excellence yields incredibly flavorful, tender and juicy beef for you and your family.

Not all Angus is equal.
Other labels may say Angus, but that's where the similarities end. The difference is in the flavor. And that's where the Certified Angus Beef ® brand sets the bar. Beef must pass 10 stringent quality specifications to earn the brand's premium mark, ensuring you always enjoy flavorful, tender, juicy cuts of beef.

Every pound of Certified Angus Beef ® product is tracked for assured product integrity. The Certified Angus Beef ® brand – truly Angus beef at its best. ®

----------------------------------------------------------------------------


Do calves have to be 100% Angus to qualify?
No, just Angus influenced. Cattle coming in to licensed packing plants need to be at least 51% black-hided or AngusSource® enrolled to be evaluated for the CAB brand. Most cattle entering feedlots are commercial cattle and are not purebred or "100% Angus." Carcasses from Angus-influenced cattle are then subjected to our ten specifications that ensure the consumer a pleasurable eating experience.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

How many Angus-influenced cattle meet CAB carcass specifications?
On a national average, only about one in five Angus and Angus-influenced cattle at licensed plants meet all ten carcass specifications and are marketed as CAB product. Establish benchmarks on what percentage of your cattle can make CAB today. The national average may be in the teens, but some producers have an average as high as 80%--the reserve heifer entry in the 2006 National Angus Carcass Challenge was 94.7% CAB and Prime. Collect harvest information on your calves and apply it to breeding and culling decisions at the individual cow level.

Back to questions

Why don't more cattle qualify for the Certified Angus Beef ® brand?
Marbling is the major reason carcasses do not become CAB product. It is also the major contributor to CAB product's characteristic flavor and juiciness.

That is why the brand's specifications indicate marbling must be "Modest or higher." The Angus breed is traditionally known for its marbling ability, and certain lines of Angus genetics have been identified with the potential to enhance their progeny's marbling level. It was this knowledge that led to the ten carcass requirements of the CAB brand.

Many cattle meeting the brand's live animal specification are crossbred, and only carry some of the Angus genetic advantage for marbling. This usually only leads to marginal success in achieving CAB acceptance. By using registered Angus bulls with positive marbling EPDs in a well-balanced selection program, producers may strengthen the marbling capability of cattle identified for the brand.

 

[gcreekrch]

Good post FH but I think you may have missed my intent.

Why would a producer go to the extra effort and cost of putting Certified Angus tags in actual Angus sired calves when the rules at the packing house state 50% black hided and to meet a certain grade. If the assn. stood by their Angus sired rule and the grading percentage was the same, would that not make the qualified product worth that much more?


How much Angus does a black Holstein have in it's ancestry?

 

[Soapweed]

Good post FH but I think you may have missed my intent.

Why would a producer go to the extra effort and cost of putting Certified Angus tags in actual Angus sired calves when the rules at the packing house state 50% black hided and to meet a certain grade. If the assn. stood by their Angus sired rule and the grading percentage was the same, would that not make the qualified product worth that much more?


How much Angus does a black Holstein have in it's ancestry?

How many black Holsteins meet the 10 specifications to qualify for the program? Not many, I'll bet. If a black Holstein carcass does qualify in all ten departments, and the quality and taste of the meat is almost assured, let them in. I'd rather eat a black Holstein that does qualify rather than a mediocre straight Angus carcass that doesn't qualify. It would appear that if a carcass meets the ten specifications, the taste is pretty well guaranteed. The CAB program is a marketing standard assuring taste. It just so happens that Angus-influenced beef is "usually" what it takes to qualify, but meeting the more stringent ten standards is what actually determines which beef is approved.